Premiere Pro CS3 HDV Editing Tips/Tricks/Issues

[Lunchbox]

I decide to start this thread to share the tips and explain the issue with using Adobe Premiere Pro CS3 in HDV editing.

Capturing
Premiere CS3 steps backward in HDV capturing. The option for scene detection is grey out as well as abort capture during drop frame. Also, during capturing, you will not be able to see a live preview. It will display a blue screen with multiple languages saying Premiere is operating media hardware.

A lot of us like to use the free utility HDVSplit to perform capture. It gives you scene detection as well as preview. Premiere captures .mpeg file whereas HDVSplit does .m2t. They are the same thing.


Pre-processing
Upon a .m2t or .mpeg file being imported to the timeline, Premiere will start to perform 3 tasks

1. Indexing
2. Audio conforming
3. Generating peak file

These process can last for hours depends on the length of the footage. You can check the progress status on the lower right corner. Before these processes finished, you won't be able to edit the footage.

If you start messing with the clips, saving, closing, existing and restarting, these processes will never be finished. It will go into a continuous loop. To avoid this, don't touch anything until these pre-processing procedures are done.

If you experience the compulsive conforming loop, quit Premiere. Locate the scratch disk folder and delete those files. Restart Premiere, load the project and don't touch it.


Audio Unsync
This is another Premiere bug being reported and regenerated by Adobe developers. Hopefully it will be fixed soon. If your HDV mpeg file has any dropouts, right after that point, audio will become out of sync.

My fix is to use other programs (Procoder, Super) to obtain the audio portion of the clip as a separate file. Import back to the timeline and relink it to the video.



HDV 24P Timeline
Premiere does not come with HDV 24P project preset for editing. You can download from adobe.com the Canon 24F preset.

http://www.hv20.com/showthread.php?t=2396

Kubrickian in this thread found using Adobe HDV60i preset modified to 24fps to edit 24p video suffers from quality loss issue. The issue was fixed using Adobe Canon 24F preset.

You can also download Premiere CS3 3.2 upgrade (see below). It comes with 24p and 30p presets.


Bait-n-Switch / Proxy Editing
You can encode a small/low quality version of the source video to edit with Premiere. In that case, you don't need to a top of the line computer for editing. Once the editing is done, point premiere to the original source file before you render output.
http://www.hv20.com/showthread.php?t=4942


Trick Premiere to generate HDV MPEG file
Follow this tips you can get Premiere to generate the exact HDV standard MPEG file recorded in tape.
http://www.hv20.com/showthread.php?t=5335


Premiere Print to Tape Possible Fix
When printing back to tape, Premiere always stop the recording around 10 minutes. Here's a possible fix but I can't guarantee. I have a higher successful to record a whole one hour tape no problem.
http://www.hv20.com/showthread.php?t=7357


Keybaord Customization
You don't need to pay for expensive video editing keyboard for the job. With Premiere, you can customize all the frequently used shortcut keys to the left side of the keyboard (or right if you are a lefty). Then hold you mouse for all the jogging motion.
http://www.hv20.com/showthread.php?t=5280


** Update on 4/19/2008 ***
Premiere Pro 3.2
This new update include 24p preset so no need to download the Canon 24F preset. It will detect drop out and insert some RED frames to the timeline display. However, it doesn't seem to fix the audio unsync issue.
http://www.hv20.com/showthread.php?t=9995


** Update on 6/2/2008 ***
Exporting Walk Throuugh
This is a thread I tried to assist another member in exporting in Premiere. Hope you will find this useful too.
http://www.hv20.com/showthread.php?t=3703


** Update on 7/23/2008 ***
Which Timeline Preset to use?
In the same project, if you have footages in 60i and 30p (or 50i and 25p), which timeline preset to be used?

Things to remember,
- 30p/25p footage can be edit in 60i/50i timeline no problem
- 60i/50i footage can be edit in 25p/30p but you need to deinterlace the 60i/50i footage. You can do so by right clicking the clip on timeline and choose "Field Options"
- For which timeline to use, pick the format with most of the footage frame rate you shot in. If the majority of footage is 60i/50i, then use a 60i/50i timeline.
- Or, you can think of what's your target output is. If it's for TV/DVD, 60i/50i timeline will be better. For computer/web, 30p/25p timeline will be better.

[Frazzle]

Thnak you for this advice, I suffer from this I think. After I have captured a clip in Premiere CS3 the files appear in the project window in italics, when I try and preview the files I get a media pending graphic displayed, very similar to the capture graphic dispalyed whilst capturing video. At the same time the clip is shown as having a 29.97fps freame rate in the Project window, despite being filmed on a PAL camera set at 25fps. Is this a result of the 3 steps you identified in you post not having beencompleted?

Could you clarify which files need to deleted to allow the conforming to restart & complete?

Which directory do they reside in, are these the files in the media cache folder?

Thanks,

Fraser

[Lunchbox]

When you first import HDV clips to premiere, you will get the "Media Pending" yellow screen until it finishes step 1, indexing.

If you video is captured in 25p, it should show up as 25fps in the project window. Otherwise, you can right click on the clip in the project window and choose "Interpret footage" to fix it.

Your scratch file location is specified in the Preferences under Scratch Disk.

Taky

[Worley]

I've been having horrible problems with Sony Vegas Pro 8 and HDV clips, so the time has come to start using Premiere.

Vegas will not import more than 8 clips at a time, and even then it's really horribly slow; and when there are 30 HDV clips on the timeline, an error occurs and Vegas closes.

Premiere pro, on the other hand loads all the clips in one go, indexes quickly, and works very smoothly.

I just have to get my head around the workflow.

Thank you Taky for your Premiere posts - they are really very useful.

[Lunchbox]

Worley, I'm glad you found it useful. I was surprise to hear there're people moving from Vegas to Premiere. I thought most of the people goes the other way.

[Frazzle]

Hi Taky,

Thanks for your reply, really useful to see someone talk about this issue. To give an update, my 25fps clips show as italics in the Project window and the frame rate shows (incorrectly) as 29.97fps until the indexing has completed.

Once the conforming has finishedvthe clip name changes from italics to normal text and the frame rate is correctly displayed.

I had been deleteing the clips after I had captured them as I was getting the media pending screen and the wrong frame rate, when all I had to do was wait until indexing had completed and avoid using Premiere CS3 at all until that had completed.

I got the same issue when I tried HDV split, but again it's just a matter of keeping your hands off Premiere after importing the clip and waiting for the indexing process to finish. I've found the scene detection feature in HDVSplit invaluable in saving time locating clips later on in the editing process. It's a shame that this feature doesn't work in Premiere yet.

BTW, I was right in that the files to delete to restart the indexing process are in the media cache folder on the PC.

[pwrshift]

I am happy using Premiere CS2 but now that I have the HV20 I've been thinking of upgrading to CS3 PP, but the guy who made my editiing computer for me said if I'm happy with CS2 he wouldn't upgrade for two reasons: 1. he doesn't see enough 'new' things to warrant the upgrade. 2. there are always problems upgrading that will slow you down until you relearn the differences. He doesn't have experience with the HV20 however.

Please note that I also use the Matrox board, if that makes any difference in 'not' upgrading to CS3.

[Worley]

New things that I think make the move worth it - time remapping and multi-core aware.

@Taky, I'm surprised too, but Adobe has been listening to users whereas Sony appears to be deaf. The Vegas capture utility does not work correctly with HDV, and Vegas appears to throw a fit with HDVSplit files (under certain conditions).

Although PP3 needed an update to work correctly with HDV files, it can work with them, and very well too.

At the moment I am under pressure and can't afford the time to figure out a new workflow, but once my current project is over, I'm inclined to remove Vegas and force myself to use Premiere.

[PTravel]

Taky, I've only done a couple of HV20 projects in CS3 to date. However, my experience has been somewhat different than yours.

First, even on a relatively long project (200-300 clips), I don't find the audio conform/peak generation process to be any longer than in prior versions of Premiere using standard definition source material. It certainly doesn't run for hours. What does take forever is the initial load of a project. I don't know what CS3 does besides verify that a clip exists, but it certainly does something. A one-hour project with a couple of hundred source clips can take as long as 20 minutes or more to load on my machine.

I also will usually start editing before audio conformance is finished. This hasn't resulted in any problems for me, and certainly hasn't caused any endless loops.

Note that I don't work in 24p, just good 'ole 60i.

Finally, I don't know if I've just been lucky and haven't experienced any drop-outs at all, but I've had no problems with audio sync (or, for that matter, with visible drop-outs, either).

[Lunchbox]

I am also in the Adobe forum, lots of people also been complaining about long project time loading. I didn't experience that.

A while back, I noticed whenever I switch focus from Premiere to another window, when I come back, it shows an hourglass for a 5 to 8 seconds before I can work again in Premiere. It gets really annoying. Then I test the same project in 32-bit vista, the problem was gone.

[PTravel]

I am also in the Adobe forum, lots of people also been complaining about long project time loading. I didn't experience that.

I read that, too, and have seen the complaints. Premiere has always been slow to load a project, but it's become ridiculous (at least for some of us) with CS3, though I can't tell if that's because now I'm editing HDV, whereas before it was just SD source material.

A while back, I noticed whenever I switch focus from Premiere to another window, when I come back, it shows an hourglass for a 5 to 8 seconds before I can work again in Premiere. It gets really annoying. Then I test the same project in 32-bit vista, the problem was gone.

I experience the same problem AND on my 32-bit Vista machine.

Ah, consistency!

[lomax]

I am recording my videos as 50i why is premiere still showing 25fps. Shouldnt it show 50i or something similiar in the project window? I am using the HDV1080(50i) Preset and when i directly export to encore and burn it onto a disc and view it on my tv i can see that there is some flickering in some objects in the scene. Its not very much. I am using Premiere Pro CS3 and Encore CS3. Anyone had same problems here and can help me out?

[Lunchbox]

50i is 50 interlace field per second (which is half a frame). It's not frame per second. From the NLE point of view, 50i is 25fps.

there are flickering on interlaced video. Shouldn't be surprise.

[lomax]

there are flickering on interlaced video. Shouldn't be surprise.

So there is no way to get rid of it?

[jaegersing]

So there is no way to get rid of it?

You are downconverting HDV to SD resolution, which means that there could be very fine details that only show up on the odd fields (or only on the even fields). This could be what is flickering. If so, one way to reduce it is to apply a slight motion blur to the footage so that these details are spread out more and therefore are not so fine.

Richard

[Lunchbox]

A simple deinterlace will do. If you are using Adobe Media Encoder, the deinterlace option is hidden on the left side of the panel.

[jbpostal]

Thanks for this helpful tips.

[alexovy]

Hello, this is my first project with HV20. I have captured the m2t files with HDVSplit but when I try to import to Adobe Premiere Pro CS3 it says "file format not supported". I have done the same thing with Vegas but I get the same message. Am I doing something wrong?

I have also tried MPEGStreamClip and when I try to create an avi it says "MPEG-2 Playback Component not installed".

Is there other way I can try?
Thankyou!

[Lunchbox]

It's their way Adobe and Sony to fight software piracy.

[Niklas]

I recently bought a new PC with Windows Vista so that I could start doing some video editing with filming I’m doing with my Canon HV20 camera. I am running a trial version on Premiere CS3 and it doesn’t recognise the camera. I’ve followed the recommendations in this forum of using HDVSlit to capture the footage, and this works. However, the problem then is that HDVSplit saves it into an .m2t file which Premiere doesn’t recognise. (I’ve read that this is a common problem with the trial version). I’ve used Streamclip to convert the .m2t files into AVI files and then import them into Premiere which works. However, converting the files takes forever and I don’t want to have that hassle, plus the AVI files end up being massive. I’ve spent lots of money on all this equipment and don’t want to buy the full version of Premiere unless I know for sure that everything will work. I feel stuck - what should I do?

[Lunchbox]

It will work for sure. I'm using it.

[Niklas]

OK, but I still want to be able to check out the trial version before I commit to paying £700 for the full programme. Is there any other capturing programme, that doesn't save the file as an m2t file?

[Lunchbox]

.m2t is just mpeg file in transport stream. Other programs can capture but it will still give you either .mpeg or .m2v or .m2t. They are all the same. That's the format stored on tape.

[destruct007]

It's their way Adobe and Sony to fight software piracy.

So if you're working with a crack it won't work?

[Eugenia Loli-Queru]

I don't know about Premiere/AE, but for Vegas it doesn't work from what I know. The hackers who unlocked the actual application didn't even notice that they also had to crack the individual codec libraries, so the cracked version of Vegas doesn't have any m2t/mpeg2 (read/write) or h.264 (write) support. You get what you pay for. ;-)