Hv30 Pal

**rick** · 2008 February 12th, 06:19

After some doubts....
I decided to wait for the HV30 because of the 30p mode but I read on a forum the PAL version doesn't contain 30p mode? Is this true?
So now I am in doubt again

If the recording system is exact the same you buy a hv30 only for the lcdscreen and that it is compatible with bigger battery?
Or am I missing something?

**Lunchbox** · 2008 February 12th, 11:19

Yeah, a black body and a better zoom rock control.

A lot of people already established it isn't any big improvement in the PAL model HV30.

Anyway, PAL signal is 25fps. 30fps is for NTSC.

**Ivan Fuentes** · 2008 February 12th, 16:50

hey... considering the current HV20 screen, the new HV30 screen is a nice and worthy adition IMHO

**Lunchbox** · 2008 February 12th, 16:51

Ivan, look at rick's first post. He already aware of the improved LCD screen

**ymj** · 2008 February 12th, 16:57

Hi,

Ordered the HV30 here in Europe, should be shipped within the next 2 weeks

As I'm new to HVx0 it made sense to start off with HV30 as opposed to HV20 especially since they both are about the same price.
Advice: I bought it in Switzerland, way cheaper (than in France at least)

HV20 700 euros
HV30 750 euros

**Alsone** · 2008 February 12th, 18:29

That kind of sucks because wasn't the point of the 30P mode to make it compatible with 15fps web video sites.

Don't we upload to the web in PAL land?

**Lunchbox** · 2008 February 12th, 18:57

I don't know what the marketing people in Canon think, I don't upload 15fps video since 1997. I certainly wants 30p not for that purpose.

Your PAL people can do 25fps web video.

**Rikki** · 2008 February 12th, 19:15

Taky, I think he meant that when we upload to the net it will convert 25p to 30p which will result in crappier footage than 30p straight.

**Ian-T** · 2008 February 12th, 19:30

Sorry..but am I the only one who thinks Canon's advertising 30p as internet friendly just a marketing gimmick? One could just deinterlace in post.."while" rendering their final product. There is no extra step involved compared to a 30p cam.....same number of steps for both. For PAL folks...there is no extra benefit for buying the HV30 over the HV20... This of course is just my opinion...

**Ian-T** · 2008 February 12th, 19:32

Also...what sites upload to 15fps? Can someone give me an example?

**Ivan Fuentes** · 2008 February 13th, 01:07

Originally Posted by Taky

Ivan, look at rick's first post. He already aware of the improved LCD screen

yeah... it's just "only lcd and bigger batt" seemed underapreciating to me... and the new LCD is something i'd really look after.

**Worley** · 2008 February 13th, 01:50

I don't see what is so special about the LCD.

I think that here in PAL regions we'd be better off buying discounted HV20 stock when the HV30 hits the streets.

**rick** · 2008 February 13th, 04:35

Thanks for the replies.
I decided to buy buy the discounted HV-20. I had a great offer by an online store because of the old model. I will buy some black paint to upgrade my HV20 myself.

cheers..

**kronk82** · 2008 February 16th, 13:34

Originally Posted by ymj

HV30 (pal) 750 euros

Where???

I read everywhere "Delivery only in Switzerland"

@rick: what price? what site? Thanks

**Alsone** · 2008 February 17th, 04:57

Originally Posted by Rikki

Taky, I think he meant that when we upload to the net it will convert 25p to 30p which will result in crappier footage than 30p straight.

Yeah thats what I meant. The US version gets 24P, 30P and 60i. The PAL version has to ghost frames to match the web rate.

It seems the PAL version only gets 25P and 50i meaning that any web videos don't fit the standard frame rate of the HV30 as they're usually 15fps or 30fps and this was one of Canon's own selling points for the HV30!!!

When the US version gets 3 speeds it seems ridiculous that the PAL version only gets 2 especially when its all software selected anyway (see the web tutorial on the HVX200 - apparently somone found out how to alter the config files on that camera meaning you can set anyframe rate you like between 2fps and 60fps - http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showthread.php?t=56245 so it shows its just software).

I've already filed a complaint with Canon about the lack of 30P for PAL users compared to US users, I suggest that other PAL users might want to do the same as this will affect your video quality to the web compared to the US version of this camera.

Go to the Canon site for your country, select support then choose complaint from the options.

**Lunchbox** · 2008 February 17th, 07:52

I don't think there is a web standard frame rate for web streaming video. If you upload a 25fps video, it streams as 25fps. The web server won't add pulldowns for you to form a 30fps video.

**Ian-T** · 2008 February 17th, 10:12

Originally Posted by Taky

I don't think there is a web standard frame rate for web streaming video. If you upload a 25fps video, it streams as 25fps. The web server won't add pulldowns for you to form a 30fps video.

This is exactly what I thought. That's why I asked the question above "What site plays video at 15 fps." I've never seen a PAL video with ghosting artifacts online etc. I stand by what I said earlier about Canon suggesting 30p is for internet friendly viewing....it's all a marketing scheme....and people are biting at it.

**ymj** · 2008 February 17th, 14:04

Originally Posted by kronk82

Where???

I read everywhere "Delivery only in Switzerland"

@rick: what price? what site? Thanks

Hi, I answered to you (PM) but here we go for everyone to enjoy:

http://www.toppreise.ch/index.php?a=131830

I don't know whether they ship outside Switzerland though...
I get it delivered in Switzerland directly as I go there every day...

**Alsone** · 2008 February 17th, 14:11

Originally Posted by Taky

I don't think there is a web standard frame rate for web streaming video. If you upload a 25fps video, it streams as 25fps. The web server won't add pulldowns for you to form a 30fps video.

I don't know about that Taky. I only know that I believe Canon said Youtube use 15FPS thus allowing every other field to be dropped on 30fps, and someone on here said Vimeo use 30fps. Assuming this to be true, it all makes 25p very awkward.

**Lunchbox** · 2008 February 17th, 14:40

Where did you hear/see Canon say YouTube uses 15fps?

This is a direct quote from canon web site.

In addition to the standard interlaced video frame rate of 60i, you may choose to set the VIXIA HV30 to capture video in 30p which is (30 progressive frames) particularly useful for footage to be used on the Internet. In addition, this setting gives enhanced quality to still images captured after recording. Excellent for action shots and sports.

As for Vimeo, I believe it will transcode your video somewhat to their codec. But the frame rate should be the same. You can try upload a 25p video to vimeo to see if it changes the frame rate.

**Ian-T** · 2008 February 17th, 14:51

After reading this post it made me think about the whole 15fps deal and I started to view more videos (particularly on Vimeo) with a keen eye and what i noticed was most videos, especially when panning, displays this jerky sort of movement. One video in particular was Worley's 35mm test footage where it starts out panning from left to right...it looked horribly jerky....as if there were every other frame missing. I downloaded the higher resolution version and wallah...smooth panning. I have noticed this phenomenon before with other videos..but this discussion made me take an extra look. I don't know if this has anything to do with what we are talking about here but it does make me suspicious.

**Documentarycorner.com** · 2008 February 26th, 11:01

Well lets not forget the color, damn its good looking!
but will it be a black wd-h43 to match it? if i had a black wd-h43 and my dm-50 on a hv30 i pay those extra 50euros any day at the week

but in preformence.. i think i rather put some extra toughts on my script then thinking about my lcd size..

**Alsone** · 2008 February 26th, 14:31

Originally Posted by Taky

Where did you hear/see Canon say YouTube uses 15fps?

Doesn't specifically mention Youtube, but this is a quote from Canon's marketing director from a news interview on Camcorderinfo.com:

"30P Frame Rate
Canon this week launched the Vixia HF100, Vixia HF10, and Vixia HV30 prosumer camcorder with a 30P (progressive) shooting mode. Unlike standard video recording at 60i or 24P resolution, 30P captures 30 full frames per second on the image sensor. This allows for cleaner downconverting for most online video, which typically has a 15fps rate. It’s a simple math issue. The process only has to remove every other frame, and the motion will render more smoothly.

“It won’t affect the speed of uploading [online video], as much as it will improve the quality of the viewing experience and the quality of being able to pause or extract a still image from motion video, said Mike Zorich, Marketing Director of the Video Division of Consumer Imaging Group at Canon. “It really increases the functionality of how you can use it. If you shoot in 30P, you’ve got smoother playback on your computer screen…and cleaner resolution photos,” he said."

http://www.camcorderinfo.com/content...ideo-34194.htm

**bamboopictures** · 2008 March 5th, 22:15

Buy the HV30 and keep the HV20 on your desk as a player! Safe the wear and tear for shoots only. Plus black look so much more pro

**Groomlake** · 2008 March 15th, 16:25

HV30 also has a new and improved processor. Whatever that means.
I decided to go for the HV30 and just got the PAL ver. yesterday and cant wait to start with it.

- I used the Pan. GS-250 before getting the HV30.

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