XH-A1 vs. DSLR

[Braceface]

Car Headlights may work! I've done that. Get a few friends' cars out there and test. And if you shoot at a little before dusk instead of night, you can MAKE a shade lens to put in front of each shot and line it with the horizon and SHOOT DAY FOR NIGHT. All you need is tinted glass. Avoid certain shots that wont work. Work to the strengths and FORGET about what you cant do. With all of the combinations we've given you, you should be ok.

[Bif]

Thanks Bif! Actually that exterior scene will just be wide shot of the house. There's some stuff going on outside but I'm not going to get that detailed. So there won't be any close-ups at all.

Suggestion: Whether you plan to use them or not, consider shooting quite a few closeups. Having them available can literally save you where your other scenes get a bit longish/laggy. One or two second closeup "cutaways" can step up the editing pace and keep the viewer from "lingering" too long on some scenes. My biggest "lament" when I hit the editing process is "Why the heck didn't I shoot more closeups for "cutaways".

Yeah I'm planning to do some test shoots with the camera. I just watched some tutorials online, I guess I will pump up the shutter speed or use the f-stop ring to get rid of grain.

Plenty of "test" footage (short takes, though) will help more than anything else, come back, capture the takes and start "playing" with them on a timeline. I'd do some of this as soon as I got my hands on the camera. The "familiarization" you get on the camera in this process will pay off big time when you actually start filming for production. So the benefits are twofold.

Thanks for reminding me about that LED light, I'm going to need one of those for the interior car scenes.

It's got a VERY effective dimmer! So it should be very flexible. Only question in my mind is how accurate the tungsten balance filter (orangeish) is with the camera set to tungsten white balance. I'll try to test that tonight and report what I find on it. If it's not that accurate, I'd go for daylight WB as long as the LED was the predominant light and let outside street tungsten stuff go amber/golden and not worry about it.

Street lighting in a lot of areas is now sodium vapor which is "nasty" to try to balance on.

Hey does anyone know at what shutter speed the footage starts to get choppy? I never what to go over that...

This depends on what kind of motion you have in the scene. I've used 1/125th with no problems, on one project I had no ND filters and couldn't get the shutter down below 1/250th. There was some action but no "choppy" rendition. If there had been someone running that would possibly have been a problem.

I just reviewed Dan Chung's 5D MkII footage on the re-enactment of battle between Mao Tze Dong's communist forces and the Nationalist forces on the 60th anniversary of communist victory. A lot of the action did look VERY choppy, but for the first couple of years the 5D MkII had no manual control in video mode, it was full auto. All he had to work with was 30p (non standard, standard is 29.97fps) and whatever the camera set for shutter, aperture, and ISO.

So in bright daylight he was stuck with high shutter speeds (I'm guessing 1/500th or higher) and the motion of troops running in some scenes is quite choppy.

After that camera had been out about 2 years Canon come out with a firmware upgrade that added manual control and common frame rates.

Now if most of what you're doing is at night, I'd recommend 1/60th to reduce any flickering or "banding" that could come from artificial lighting. The line frequency in our country is 60Hz and if the shutter speed is not some multiple of that you could see some problems. 1/60th would give a motion blur effect that is not far off from the 1/48th sec the 180 degree rotating shutter used to give on film cameras.

If you needed more exposure and didn't have much fast motion to deal with, you could use 1/30th which is consider a .5 multiple of 60Hz (another thing to try in your testing).

Bruce Foreman

[Bif]

About the LED light...

It's got a VERY effective dimmer! So it should be very flexible. Only question in my mind is how accurate the tungsten balance filter (orangeish) is with the camera set to tungsten white balance. I'll try to test that tonight and report what I find on it. If it's not that accurate, I'd go for daylight WB as long as the LED was the predominant light and let outside street tungsten stuff go amber/golden and not worry about it.

Street lighting in a lot of areas is now sodium vapor which is "nasty" to try to balance on.

I ran a quick test on this LED light and the filter supposed to change the light to 3200K. As I've read in a few posts the results are a bit "greenish" with WB set to Tungsten and the "orange" filter over the light. I put the clips on the timeline of the NLE I use (Avid Pinnacle Studio 15 Ultimate Collection) and in video effects selected "Color Correction".

This lets me work with Brightness & Contrast, Hue and Saturation, Intensity (Gain, Gamma, Black level), and then Gain, Gamma, and Black level in each of the color channels. Reducing the Gain in the Green channel a very small bit added just enough Magenta to make skin tones look normal, so if you have tungsten street lights, vehicle lights, and some porch lights in the background (plus someone's headlights partially illuminating a house as Braceface suggested) the slight amount of magenta correction for skin tones shouldn't hurt a thing.

If you're dealing with sodium vapor streetlights doing some illumination the slight uncorrected green cast might not matter although I would correct it some anyway.

Using the light with WB set to daylight and no orange filter skin tones looked pretty much OK.

So now you know a bit more about these inexpensive LED lights than you did before. I'm thinking of ordering a second one so I can set up key and fill if needed.

Bruce Foreman

[Almohada]

Thanks, Bif. Definitely going to pick one up and experiment with it! Will probably do need to color correct those exterior house shots, depending on the street light - if there is one at all.

[peterarcson]

The camera does what the operator has the skills to make it do. Concerning "DSLR is not (an ENG camera)", tell that to Dan Chung, a journalist who frequently uses DSLR to make visually stunning documentaries in China and other worldwide locations, much of the time having to use ENG approach to keep up with events.

A comment found on a site that had one of his efforts in Uganda:

Dan’s taking this camera off the shelf and out into the world where it can shine light on issues that need to be seen and heard. The intrinsically high production quality imagery the 5dmarkii is producing can only further justify what an invaluable tool this camera is when placed in the right hands. What’s most amazing to me is the intimacy Chung is capturing in his subjects whilst running and gunning.

And another (News video shot on 5DmkII - The Economic crisis hits China):

If all news only looked this good! Something about the filmic black crush of the 5dmarkii that takes what typical ENG Digibeta would capture and turns it into docu-gold.

Dan Chung is not the only one. You guys can "pontificate" all you want about what is suitable for what, but the "REAL PROS" are out there producing professional results with whatever the heck is put in their hands.

I've said before "I don't have a dog in this hunt". I use what I use (actually both conventional video cameras and DSLRs) and others can have their preferences. But it flat bothers me to see IGNORANCE and PREJUDICE pushed as "truth".

Those who are looking to learn here just may believe it.

Bruce Foreman

What you are saying is simply not rue. there might be a photog here and there shooting with DSLR, but for 99% of programming in HD such footage will be rejected just on technical issues. what is required by vast majority of networks and broadcast is i-frame (like DVCPRO HD, IVC-Intara) @100 Mb/s minimum or mpeg2 50Mb/s 422. DSLR have too low of a bite rate of mpeg 4, with 420 color. if you are established and the network is interested in the material you might try to pitch it, for 99.9% of others i say good luck shooting with dslr and the trying to sell it.

[Dr. Benway]

What you are saying is simply not rue.... 99% of programming in HD such footage will be rejected just on technical issues... others i say good luck shooting with dslr and the trying to sell it.

DSLR's all over the show here in Thailand, in conjunction with a plethora of Sony, Panny, Canon AVCHD and HDV 'camcorders'.

[cgbier]

There are many levels of broadcast - our local station is even happy with Hi8 or VHS-C, for PBS you need at least an EX-1 (per their redbook).

[Dr. Benway]

Hilarious watching the interlacing though. Some guys have learned the correct camera or post settings though, but those interlacing lines... jeez!

[Almohada]

Ok, this is pissing me off... I don't know which way to go.

I've been reading on different forums and some people say this method could work: Out from XH-A1 using yellow RCA cable, into this converter cable and plug it into the monitor's VGA port.

http://www.amazon.com/TV-out-VGA-S-V.../dp/B000P3UB24


OR I can do this method: BNC out from XH-A1, BNC into this converter, VGA out and into monitor

http://cgi.ebay.com/CCTV-Composite-S...ht_5841wt_1115


I think the BNC method is safer. The RCA cable has gotten mixed reviews and I'm afraid it won't work with my monitor. Plus I'd rather use a nice heavy duty BNC cable as opposed to a short thin RCA which could get trampled over on set.

[Almohada]

So should I go RCA or BNC?

[Almohada]

Alright guys, I need to order this today. I'm leaning towards BNC...
Give me your opinions

[antman]

what is it you need to order? Monitor?

There's not much I don't know about the XHA1, AND XHA1'S. I have both, and have done a good amount of shooting on them. As far as getting a good filmic look, your going to want to approach you custom settings the ay you would on pretty much any cam, So forget the scene files, make your own flat picture profile, it will give you at least another stop in latitude, and you will start to see detail in the shadows where as if you were to use a setting like OUTSIDEN, DVXMATCH,NATURALLO. You wouldn't see. So just go in to pic settings, and adjust to the flattest picture you can dial in, then tweak from there. It took me a good day to get a profile that I think is great for color grading with the most latitude you can possibly get out on an xha1.

As far as monitoring your image, I would go with the craig 15" monitor, it has component in and can run off a 12 volt battery. And it's high def 720p. You cant find a better monitor with the same options for the price anywhere. If you run composite out, your only getting an sd signal, I mean thats fine for a directors monitor, but who ever is pulling focus will want a good sharp monitor. you can find them on ebay, or at Cvs pharmacy for around 100 bucks.

[Almohada]

A new monitor is "out of the budget." There isn't a focus puller - the camera op will be doing that looking at the LCD. I need a directors monitor -- I already have a 21" computer monitor BUT with VGA and DVI inputs. So, I need to know which route to take.

BNC to VGA ---OR--- composite (yellow RCA) to VGA????????

The BNC to VGA converter is $22 bucks while the RCA to VGA wire is only a few bucks... BUT I've read that the RCA to VGA wire doesn't always work. So I'm thinking to get the BNC converter. I posted links to these above...

[antman]

Thats correct, I tried the component to vga cable, and had no luck.

So your shooting straight xha1, no dof adapter, that makes it a bit easier to not have to deal with a 1st Ac. this will save some time. As far as low light, Azymth shot his feature on a stock hv40, So you really cant compare it to the xha1, the A1, is much better in low light than the hv40, But you will still need some lights, your plan to grab some work lights should be fine. Just pick your locations wisely, ad try to find them with some ambient light to create added depth to the scene.

You ca get some nice dof out of the A1, just zoom in an move back. Even though it has a small sensor, it has a killer L SERIES LENS. I t's prone to a little chromatic aberation, but nothing I would worry about. If you have any question feel free to pm me. Like I said, I know that cam pretty well. good luck with your film

[Almohada]

Thanks antman!

Alright, so I'm going to grab that BNC to VGA converter and probably a 50 foot BNC cable (why not?). I hope it works!!!!!

[Almohada]

I'm really worried about the converter's output:

Supported VGA output resolution: 800 x 600@60HZ, 800 X 600@75HZ, 1024 x 768@60HZ, 1280 x 1024@HZ.

[Almohada]

Alright I think I need something like this....

http://cgi.ebay.com/1080P-RGB-YPbPr-...#ht_3042wt_995


It says it supports High Definition output, 1080p. $38 is going to break the bank... I guess it's still cheaper than buying a new monitor PLUS I get to preview in HD.

[Almohada]

What do you guys think about the converter in the last post?

[Bif]

If it does what the description and photos show, it should work. Component out from camcorder to the three inputs on the converter and one of the outputs to the monitor.

If you have enough "manpower" to horse the monitor into the needed position it should help. Also regarding the cost, you should be able to use that setup with most any other camcorder including the HV series.

One time I gave a program presentation on digital retouching before I had a projector (it was that presentation that made me go out and buy one!). I "lugged" in a 21.6" Samsung monitor and figured the club members would cluster around where they could see.

Nope.

They sat all around the room and I don't know if any of them got any of the visual material. So I bought a digital projector and brought the Conch Valley Photography Club into the digital age.

Anyway, I think that converter should work and I believe you'll get more use out of it later.

Bruce Foreman

[Almohada]

Alright, I think I'm going to go for it. There's no other way. I'm also going to get a long VGA cable instead of an RGB and coupler cable.

Well I'd use it for my HV but I already have an HDMI out to DVI cable that I use with this same monitor. But I guess I have another option now!

By the way I made a stand for my LCD monitor. I'll probably start a thread

[Almohada]

Alright, just picked it up and a 50 ft. VGA cable. The VGA was much cheaper than an RGB + coupler. I wanted to do the RGB so I can leave the converter box right next to the monitor and not tangling wires around the camera, but we have a tight budget so we'll have to deal with all the wires near the camera!

Thanks for all your help everyone.

[Almohada]

Hey guys, big problem....I tested out the XH-A1 today. Very, very nice camera. BUT the Component cable is missing!!!!!!!!!!!! We need one like this:

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produc...ent_Video.html

$42.95 ???? Why????? WHY????????

Does anyone have an extra cable lying around that I can borrow for a week or two? I'll ship it right back after the shoot. Please!

[Almohada]

Anyone? Please!

[BarteS]

Perhaps Seo can help you out? He's just back in the USA. I sent him the link to your request.

[Almohada]

Thanks!!!!

Yeah I just spent 50+ bucks on that stupid converter and cable. I found someone selling a pro Sony field monitor for that much!!! If I knew the wire was unavailable I would've just used BNC to a new monitor...

Please!!! The shoot will only be 2 or 3 days, and I might do a test shoot to make sure everything works so I'll only need it for about a week. I'll pay for shipping, it should only be a dollar or two