Monitor Size

[pascalbrown]

I'm about to purchase an HV20 (when I decide on the whole PAL/NTSC thing) and I've just bought a rather powerful PC (E6600 @ 3.2Ghz!, 2GB, 1Tb, 7950GT, etc). The only thing that remains is a new monitor. Since I want to start working in HD it would make sense to buy a monitor that can display full HD. This limits me to atleast a 24". Infact, I don't want to go any bigger than that! To those who are working on monitors smaller than 24" (or monitors not able to display 1920) what do you do to watch footage? Do you watch it on your HDTV? (which I don't have!). Advice is welcome. Thanks.

To add one more thing. A very good 22" monitor can be bought for £200 here in the UK, whereas a 24" is going to cost me in the region of £450. Quite a difference. I guess that's what is holding me back!

[Critters]

CRTs would display a HD signal at < 24", just takes up more desk space.
I have a DELL 24" flat panel and it is superb. You do not need a large screen to appreciate the HD footage as you are sitting WAY WAY closer than you would to a TV.

[pascalbrown]

I guess I should have added that I've moved away from CRT's. The weight of my old Iiyama 22" CRT nearly broke my desk. I'm thinking of purchasing the dell 24" as it seems reasonably priced and with excellent reviews.

I'm only going to get another LCD so that means a 22" will only display 1680*1050 so any fullHD footage will either be off the side of the screen or will be somehow compressed (surely loosing quality!?)

Thanks.

[Critters]

the video card would scale it to fit the displays native resolution, it should do a very good job of it, I doubt you would notice the difference. TBH if your spending that much on a PC I would go for a screen that supports 1920x1200 res.

[Murrelet]

I just went through this process and wanted the LG 24", but like you stated, it's almost double the price, so I settled on the 22". I chose this monitor for the HDMI port, price, and the fact that LG was the only one with HDMI available at our local community franchise electronics store.

The model I chose is the LG 22" - L226WA. The HV20 can play back straight to the monitor via the HDMI, but you need to buy that cable. I run the computer on DVI (had to purchase this as well) and playback from the HV20 directly to the monitor via HDMI.

As the monitor has no speakers it is supplied with a sound out port (just below the Component connections), so a simple cord to my sound card takes care of that.

The 22" displays in 1680 x 1050. The 24" displays in 1920 x 1080 (probably 1200). I was on a budget and got the 22" so I could also afford to purchase Vegas.

I would advise to select a monitor with HDMI. Open your choice of monitor box at the dealer and literally take inventory of the cables, and get what you need (probably HDMI and DVI - these can be very expensive).

The LG has a pamphlet in the box that states under Accessories: DVI-D Signal Cable (This feature is not available in all countries). I didn't see the statement in brackets, and had to make another trip back into town. As well it didn't come with a Stereo Mini Cable, remember HDMI is sound and video feed, so you need a way to get the sound to your computer if the monitor doesn't have speakers. If it helps, take a pic of the back of your computer so you have a photo inventory of all your connections, especially from your sound and video card or motherboard.

I love spending other peoples money, so go for the 24"!!

[pascalbrown]

Murrelet; thanks for the post. I was kind of thankful you were banging on about how great the 22" LG was because it's a load cheaper but then at the end you decided to recommend the 24"! ha ha.

I'll have to think about it a little more first. I mean, I could buy two 22" monitors for the price of the 24" so it's a big difference. Thanks for the advice though.

[Murrelet]

Yeah I know, the price does take a huge leap, and the response times are slower, not that I'd be able to see the difference, but it would be nice to have the true HDV format, this one is close, looks great.

Got about an hours worth of a grey whale and her calf today at my paragliding site. A bit boring, but I had to keep it rolling in case something exciting happened. Just going to view it now.......

[Brandy]

24" Dell here. Love it.

[Critters]

Did you know that HDMI can be converted to DVI with a simple adaptor? This would let you view HDMI through any monitor with a DVI port (all good LCD panels) I googled this image to show you what they look like, it is not a powered box, it is a simple plug changer:
http://www.computercablesource.com/images/516-007.jpg

On a side note my Dell has Component, composite, s-vid, VGA, DVI and picture in picture... That is why they are higher priced.

[pascalbrown]

When converting HDMI to DVI what is lost? or is it a lossless conversion? Surely it doesn't retain sound? does it?

[Dodgy Nick]

I've got a 32" monitor that only displays 1366x768, so I'm also in the market for a new HD-capable monitor. Samsung has brought out a very affordable new 24" DVI capable monitor (SM-245B) which might bring about a price war. You can pre-order on overclockers (in the UK):

http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showpr...odid=MO-054-SA

Currently it's £387, has a superfast 5ms grey-to-grey response time and displays 1920x1200. I've read a couple of reviews, and the only negative point about this monitor seems to be the restricted horizontal viewing angle.

I'm wondering whether that could affect using this as a field monitor for doing indoor shoots, because that's what I want it for, as well as a monitor for editing.

[pascalbrown]

So that's decided then. I'm going to wait a couple of weeks and order a 24" Samsung. Sweet. Also of note, Acer have just released a new 24" that will apparently retail for under £340. Think you may be right about a price war. Great for the consumer! (in the short term!)

[bluegrass]

When converting HDMI to DVI what is lost? or is it a lossless conversion? Surely it doesn't retain sound? does it?

Your absolutely right. HDMI added audio to it's interface standard along with some other intellegence but as for as DVI montiors go, I used a conversion cable that went from the HDMI out of the "twenty" into a DVI on a monitor. No trouble. I think your good to go as for as using DVI connections instead of purchasing a new monitor just to get the HDMI interface. You might not find any 1920 monitors without an HDMI interface though or the reverse, you not likely to find any DVI monitors that suppport 1920.

By the way, I'm pretty sure that when you plug in a HDTV into the HDMI camcorder interface you won't hear audio on your HDTV. At least I didn't. I had to connect up my audio amp/speakers to the A/V out of the camera when playing my HDV tape via HDMI to listen.

[bluegrass]

I was interested in checking out this monitor. I must say that I'm really surprised that I found no place selling it in the US. Every Google link I found about this monitor led me overseas - mostly Europe. I thought I'd see what I could find out from the horses mouth so I went to Samsung. Guess what? They don't even list the product in the product listings. They did list a SM-245BW which doesn't appear to be the same product.

Guess will have to wait awhile for this puppy to show up in the US sales chain. I also Google for Acer's latest & coudn't find a new 24" yet.

I will try and keep my eyes out for either of these to be available.

[Critters]

You might not find any 1920 monitors without an HDMI interface

If we are still talking about PC screens this is wrong, I doubt you would be able to find a PC LCD monitor that has HDMI, PC monitors have VGA or DVI, as they have DVI there is no need for HDMI. If you are talking about TV's then you are correct, but this is a discussion about PC monitors.

you not likely to find any DVI monitors that support 1920.

Wrong, I doubt you could find a 1920 LCD PC monitor that does NOT have DVI.

Only with the cheaper, less than 19" LCD monitors, sometimes have VGA and no DVI option. I think you would be hard pressed to find a screen larger than 19" that does not do DVI as VGA doesn't cut it at high resolutions.

[johnbatista]

right i'm new to HD cameras and editing HD.
Before i buy this camera can you tell me.. I have a crappy DELL (6H507) 14" VGA flatscreen and can't afford to upgrade, can i edit true hd footage from the HV20 on it or not?

[johnbatista]

if i can view the raw .m2t files i can right?

[bluegrass]

right i'm new to HD cameras and editing HD.
Before i buy this camera can you tell me.. I have a crappy DELL (6H507) 14" VGA flatscreen and can't afford to upgrade, can i edit true hd footage from the HV20 on it or not?

In my opinion the speed of your computer and the amount of memory is going to be more important to editing and creating your files than the monitor. I've been doing all of my editing in 1024 X 768. If you can do that, than I don't see why you can't edit assuming you have enough soup in your computer. I don't know what that model has. Another thing that you need to consider is that you have enough disk space. If your going to capture an hour of video and than rendor about an hour, you better have at least 30 gig free. You can reduce the amount of capture and output if you have less. These are only my opinions that have come from my experience. Different OS's and apps can make a difference on hardware requirements.

Also when you say your new to HD cameras and HD editing, I problably wouldn't be wrong in guessing that over 80% of the people on this forum are new to HD cameras and HD editing. Hopefully you have already experinect SD and SD editing. If you haven't done either, you really want to take several mini steps as you approach HD. I hate to see you leap into purchasing the camera and not have a little room financially for some other items such as some software and memory etc.

The bottom line to your question is you probably can get by with your monitor but there is so many other factors you need to consider that I tried to mention. Keep in mind also that depending on how much you wind up paying for the camera, you can easily pick up a 17" monitor for the low 100's which could wind up what you save under retail. I wound up buying retail but I enjoyed the comfort level I had with dealing with a well recoginzed & known reputable retailer.

[johnbatista]

Thanks for you words of wisdom.
I have plenty experience with editing standard DV footage and my computer is a pretty ok spec as i also do alot of 3D work with Maya.
For some reason i have had a bit of trouble playing some of the high res footage on here, it lags a bit and lines across the screen. Is this to do with the NTSC/PAL crap?

[pascalbrown]

I would guess that is to do with your video card not keeping up. I would also suggest that you buy a 17" CRT for editing since the extra screen real estate would be handy. Plus, you can walk into a shop and get a 17" CRT for under £10. I did exactly that in sheffield for a friend of mine. Bought him a second hand 17" CRT last year for £5 from a PC shop in sheffield. That's got to be an upgrade from a 14" anything!

[bluegrass]

Thanks for you words of wisdom.
I have plenty experience with editing standard DV footage and my computer is a pretty ok spec as i also do alot of 3D work with Maya.
For some reason i have had a bit of trouble playing some of the high res footage on here, it lags a bit and lines across the screen. Is this to do with the NTSC/PAL crap?

The NTSC/PAL crap I know nothing about but have supported computers for a long long time, I know when you're trying to move a lot of data to the screen the video adaptor and the speed of the computer play a big part also? How much memroy does your video adaptor have. Is it very old. Since you're doing 3D rendering without a problem I wouldn't think it would be your adaptor. I would maybe test a few clips with different resolutions and see what happens. I would think that your adapter and RLE is going to downres any HD content anyway so I would think you would be OK. I wouldn't think you will be able to see true HD for sure with what you presently have, but I still believe you can edit HD. What is goal after you shoot HD. In other words where is the HD content going to wind up being viewed after it's been edited?

[johnbatista]

£5!! Thats pretty great.
My graphics card is pretty low end really, an Ati Radeon x1600 Pro 512mb and have 2gb of system memory.
I'm wanting to make a short film for an upcoming student film festival at college, will be a public show on a big screen close to cinema size. So it would be good to get true HD.
I imagine its the actual rendering rather than editing of the 1080i footage that may cause my machine to crash?

I've just dragged a 1280 x 720 piece of footage, Solomon chase's, and it seems ok. A little jumpy on playback.
But thats already been rendered out.
I need some raw footage to mess around with really.

[Critters]

The best thing you can prob do to make editing HD smooth is to get more RAM, that goes up quite a bit compared to editing SD. HDD space and speed are a constant as even though the image is larger the compression is better, so it's pretty much the same file size. Sure CPU is important, but I have been impressed at how little the difference is in editing HDV compared to DV (esp compared to how processor intensive editing AVCHD is)

[Murrelet]

"I doubt you would be able to find a PC LCD monitor that has HDMI"

Gee Critters, I have the LG 22" MONITOR (L226WA), and it's got HDMI, and so does it's more expensive counterpart the 24", which is why I was attracted to this monitor in the first place (actually, the 2 LG monitors were the only ones they had with HDMI, but they figured the other companies wouldn't be far behind).

I have DVI going from computer to monitor, and I have the HDMI connected to the monitor, with the free end hanging on a hook. When I want to use the monitor to preview tape, I plug the HDMI free end into the HV20, and set the cam on play. I then hit the 'source' button on the monitor's front and change from DVI to HDMI and it's up and running the days tape. Love the monitor and the HV20.

Oh, and for sound, there is a 'sound out' port on the LG that's connected to my X-Fire sound card. The audio coming from the sound system adds another whole dimension.

[johnbatista]

also can you capture the HDV footage with Premiere 1.5? Cos 2 ain't working on windows Vista for me