Ebay - Cheap Lighting System 800w + Muslin

[Mr. S]

All,

As a newb and trying to conduct standard interviews, wouldn't this be good for the price?

Ebay Light Deal

I just thought I'd share too in case other people are looking for a quick fix without spending hundreds of dollars. Please advise and try to look beyond "ebay", but the actual product + watts, etc.

Thanks!

S

[voodeux]

Looks like a 5600K system, which isn't great for indoor work. You'll also probably want to move beyond that mono-color backdrop (unless its a look you're going for). Finally, umbrella lights, while cheap and portable have too much spill. A good kit will have softboxes, eggcrates, hairlight with snoot, a background light (fresnels work well). It pays to do some research and rent a decent light kit. If you're on a budget, I can understand. But a good light kit will outlast your next 2 cameras, so it's worth investing a bit more for quality gear. Look to Arri, Lowel, Chimera, and Mole-Richardson for workhorse lighting gear. Read some books on lighting and you'll see what's involved and why it's worth spending some money on good equipment. If you can afford to go slowly, build up your kit over time getting the best lights that suit your needs.

[Bif]

That "quick fix" kit appears to be mostly JUNK stuff. The stands extending only 7 feet will typically be of pretty flimsy construction. The lamp heads have no reflectors I can see and you will be literally "spilling" light all over the place with little or no control.

The background stand setup even looks flimsier than anything similar I have used in the past.

The lamp socket/swivel mount with umbrella channel doesn't look sturdy enough to support the weight of 32" umbrellas. A friend of mine ordered a similarly priced kit from B&H and when I helped him to set it up I felt really sorry for him, nothing would stay locked in adjustment.

For stands you might look at the 13' stands offered at alienbees.com or check B&H for a pair of lightweight but sturdy 13' air cushion stands. These are similar to what I have and the price is about what I paid 4 years ago in a Waco TX camera store:

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produc...eavy_Duty.html

And this is what I use for lighting units. Instead of up to 250w tungsten bulbs I use "bright white" or photo grade CFL lamps. These CFL lamps give me plenty of soft light (with no umbrellas required) and have very low current draw developing no real heat. One caution is that if the stand is extended near full height the bottom of the stand should be weighted with "shot" filled bags or some other weight to keep the light from tipping. Here is the link to B&H:

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produc..._Cool_10_.html

This would be a fair start with gear that will last you. Cheap is grief in this case. Flimsy stuff that will not stay locked in adjustment will leave a real negative impression with clients, interviewees, and anyone watching. All you need to start is 2 stands and 2 light units. For a background light you can even use a hardware store clamp reflector with a CFL in it, if what's out front looks professional.

[Mr. S]

Thanks for investing the time in my setup. You're right, I began researching lighting and realized I need to do additional reading in order to fully grasp the concept. Although the lights you suggested break my budget, I'm currently looking at other options. What do you all think about this particular kit?

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produc...Light_Kit.html

Thanks!

S

[Mr.V]

Speaking of Books...can any one recommend a really good book on lighting?
would appretiate :-)

[cgbier]

Books? Book!

[zephyrnoid]

Books? Book!

Good call on the book. Even as a pro lighting dude it look interesting. I'll buy that.
To answer the posters question on the e-bay kit.
Bif nailed it. Junk.
Daylight fluorescent are great for soft close up lighting or if you can get a hold of some big bank lights, even at medium distances. 800W of Fluorescent lights are not the same as 800W of incandescent lights. Wattage is about draw not lumen output- so they'll be fairly feeble at Middle distances. If interviews are at 8' from camera or so, they should be fine. But to reiterate what Bif said, they will last you 3 or 4 uses before something breaks. Notice these are mass produced China made for e-bay. Thus fittings will be low quality etc etc. Beginners will not look as 'Pro' using hardware store lights, but you'll have way better use of your money an get better and more powerful lighting to boot.
Don't forget to leverage available light + your kit. Daylight + Incans is my favorite combo lately (I like to break the rules) I even use some pricey flashlights for hairlights, accents and corner of the room fillers. No time for a book on all that though

[voodeux]

I strongly suggest reading the book before buying a single piece of equipment. You might also want to donate your time/services to a pro videographer in your area doing interviews. If they are good, you'll learn more in 2 shoots than you would from months of trial and error. I still say avoid the umbrellas. Until you can control spill, your videos will have a 'cheaply-lit' look to them. That was my mistake when I first started out. Being on limited budget, umbrellas where the easy choice. If you want your work to really shine, you'll need (at some point) a decent softbox or two, light modifiers (bounce cards, flags, gobos) and a fresnel for hard lighting. I can promise you that no good kit will be found for under $500 (3 lights with accessories). But if you can't spend that much, start with 2 or 3 good stands, softbox w/grid and a 5-way reflector (pop-up style). You can get away with using cheaper worklights for backround lighting (in a pinch), but if you screw up your keylight and fill, the rest is pretty much sure to follow suit.

[Mr. S]

Good call. Thanks for the advice everyone. I think I'm going to get something small to learn from and that I can build on. Does anyone have any insight on this particular setup?

http://www.adorama.com/LTOR3.html?se...orama+adorlite

[cgbier]

The stands look flimsy to me!
Why don't you go with the lights Bif has suggested?
Better buy something good once than crap twice.

[zephyrnoid]

Ya know, some people just want the 'Kit' no matter what advice they get from the pros. I can't blame them, "KIT" has a rounded, cozy comforting sound to it. My first ever lighting kit was nearly identical to that Adorama one you cited. Except mine was just clamp-on lights that I adapted to go on top of cheap music stands. It lasted as long as it needed to and adjusted for inflation, cost about the same as the Adorama kit. That would have been decades ago. So go for it, but realize that you will not be able to toss a kit like that around as you hustle to get to location.
You may decide that you hate doing lighting and all that you'll have lost would be $130 anyway. So no big deal.

[Bif]

Pretty much everything in that price range is the same. Flimsy stands, tilting adjustments that won't hold for long, you ought to get the picture by now.

If you can afford the $129 or so you can afford one 13' air cushioned (if one of your sections loosens the sections above sink slowly instead of slamming down) stand, and one of the SmithVictor units (10" refelector, A100 - the squarish PL10 takes a long neck bulb only). A large piece of white foamcore as a reflector can provide fill if positioned correctly.

Add the second stand and a light unit for it as you can afford it.

All of the interior shots in this short were done with one A100 and a 100w equiv "bright white" CFL: [ame="http://www.vimeo.com/1262033"]The Devil's Due on Vimeo[/ame]

[Mr. S]

Bif,

Nice vid! That was neat. I saw your light work and that single lamp looked highly effective. I'll have to re-evaluate my decision.

Thanks again.

Mr. S

[Mr. S]

Okay, what do you all think of this Smith-Victor ultra cool set up?

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produc...ten_Light.html

I might stretch for this if it will get me good results. The light stands, are not air cushioned, but they look of a more sturdy build.

S

[voodeux]

Why do I get the feeling that I'm talking to a brick wall here?

[Halsu]

Why do I get the feeling that I'm talking to a brick wall here?

Probably ;-)

...but as far as umbrellas go, they're pretty usable in my opinion. The best thing about them is portability and speed - they're easy to lug around and quick to set up.

One way to control spill is to use a silver umbrella to bounce the light fom - it doesn't leak through. And of course, in many occasions some spill (read ambient light) is actually desirable.

[Mr. S]

Okay, okay. fine. Still junk. Although the last setup was very similar to the one prescribed, but I see its still considered junk. Got it. lol, I admit, I'm quite the ignoramus and stubborn basterrrd on this. I tried. :-p. But seriously, thanks again everyone.

S

[Roy]

Haha, Mr. S, I think we're all starting to know what your S stands for...Stubborn. j/king! :-).

Actually, your last link that referred to the "Smith-Victor Ultra Cool Kit" is not bad. It's the same light Bif was referring to, but smaller. The light stands are much more sturdier than the original ebay post. I wouldn't be too concerned with air cushioned stands at this point, as long as the stands are sturdy and reliable. The Raven RS8 stands included in this kit should be decent enough.

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produc...ten_Light.html

I think you have a good shot with this kit. Besides, its Smith-Victor and there's a 2-year warranty from B&H. This should be good in case something breaks, which isn't always included by Ebay sellers.

Also, I recommend getting barn-door accessories for this kit so that you can control the light with more options and have more of a "pro" look.

I've been perusing the forums and appreciate your post. I think it helps other newbs that are facing similiar issues with light kit decisions. Let us know which light setup you decide on.

Thanks!

Roy

[zephyrnoid]

Why do I get the feeling that I'm talking to a brick wall here?

Read my other post. He just wants to LOOK like he knows his lighting. See?
Now that he's jumped from $130 to $350 he can actually afford the right kit:
1, used Lowel Omni w/ Barndoors ($60)
1, used Lowel V-Light or Tota ($15-$40)
1, a second used Omni or Pro-Light
1, used Lowel 42" Silver umbrella ($12)
3, used old black steel Smith Victor light stands ($12-$15 each)
1, used 40" Reflectasol disc or automotive shop clone ($10)

Cheap footlocker from Target ($?)
Foam.

Unfortunately, that doesn't leave enough dough for that excellent book that was recommended, but I honestly think this person needs to learn lighting on his own- the hard way.

[Halsu]

Unfortunately, that doesn't leave enough dough for that excellent book that was recommended, but I honestly think this person needs to learn lighting on his own- the hard way.

Well, he just wants to do basic interviews. It's not rocket sicience really... this is a good place to start:

http://www.lowel.com/edu/

[movielighter]

Bought 2 freznal kits ($399.00) and a few other things from this company and have been very happy with them. One 3 light kit with softboxes works fine for interviews and they can be dimmed as well. Bulbs are very inexpensive
and stands are heavy duty. I stepped up from the Smith Victors to these.



http://imagewest.tv/index.asp?PageAc...TS&Category=34

[Mr. S]

movielighter, thank you very much for the info!

S

[fishops]

Be very careful on that site. They advertise "open faced fresnel" lamps which are a contradiction in terms. There's no such thing as an "open face fresnel", either a lamp has a fresnel lens or not. Their $399 kit is a bunch of open face halogens which are not in any way fresnels.

[fishops]

Also, be careful with lowel fixtures. They're great at what they do, which is pack a ton of light into a very small, portable package. The tradeoff is that compared to other halogen solutions they're fragile and hot. They are not necessarily the best bang for your buck.

That said, a Tota bounced off the ceiling or an umbrella is a great, cheap, tiny way to raise ambient light, and their Pro light is probably the best rim light ever invented. Just be aware of what you're getting. Their Omni and Fren-L are somewhat crappy in my experience.

A great way to get cheap, sturdy fresnels is to use stage lights. Look for used Altman, Strand, Mole or Ianiro fresnels on Ebay or Craigslist. If they don't have baby stud receivers, you can pick up yoke adapters from Cool Lights or BH for about 11 bucks a piece. I scored a bunch of old Altman 750w fresnels from a high school for 25 bucks a pop.

[TiE_Shepherd]

Be very careful on that site. They advertise "open faced fresnel" lamps which are a contradiction in terms. There's no such thing as an "open face fresnel", either a lamp has a fresnel lens or not. Their $399 kit is a bunch of open face halogens which are not in any way fresnels.

I don't know what you're taking about. I got some tungsten HMI's from them and they're the best.