In a pickle

[Inapickle]

Hi,

I'm looking at making the jump from DV to HD (are there any of us left ?!!!). Like most folks, I'm weighing up the pros and cons of AVCHD vs HDV. Cant deny the appeal of a tapeless system and am considering maybe an HF11 or HF-S100/10. Managed to find a few raw HF11 1080/30p m2ts clips, which are quite impressive but I'm rather put off by the conspicuous motion artifacts (ghosting and chroma trails), not to mention some aliasing on high contrast edges/fine line detail (viewed on LCD)- not sure if the latter is a by-product of the PsF technology or not. I've read that the HF-S100/10 are less prone to these artifacts, but cant find any raw test footage from these models other than a few relatively static shots of flowers and views from bedrooms etc. Does anyone out there have any decent raw footage (ideally with moving, "warm-bodied" subjects) that might assist.

On the HDV side, the obvious choice is an HV30/40 (since I want 30p), but again I've been hard-pressed to find good raw test clips to scrutinize. I know motion artifacts are not really a problem in this case (??), but I'm keen to know if aliasing might be....having spent many years trying to eliminate aliasing from footage shot in Procinema/Frame Mode (i.e. pseudo-progressive frames) on my Pana NV-GS400. Also is audio pick-up of tape-hiss noise still a factor on the HV30/40, as it was on the HV20?

Cheers. Hopefully soon I'll be joining your ranks as a bone-fide Canon owner.

[previdman]

... is audio pick-up of tape-hiss noise still a factor on the HV30/40, as it was on the HV20?..

It's not tape hiss, it's motor noise and yes, it's still a factor when using the onboard HV mic. Most noticeable in quiet scenes as you might expect.

Obviously NOT a problem with a solid state camera.

That said, I still like tape for archival backup.

[Inapickle]

Managed to find a few raw HF11 1080/30p m2ts clips, which are quite impressive but I'm rather put off by the conspicuous motion artifacts (ghosting and chroma trails), not to mention some aliasing on high contrast edges/fine line detail (viewed on LCD)- not sure if the latter is a by-product of the PsF technology or not. I've read that the HF-S100/10 are less prone to these artifacts, but cant find any raw test footage from these models other than a few relatively static shots of flowers and views from bedrooms etc. Does anyone out there have any decent raw footage (ideally with moving, "warm-bodied" subjects) that might assist.

As a case in point, the 'new' HF-S10 videos put up on Vimeo in this series are very nice, both the Washington and Atlanta clips:

http://www.hv20.com/showpost.php?p=217778&postcount=1

Cant help but noticing though the conspicuous aliasing on high contrast edges, even on the 1280x720 mp4 download. Now is that merely a product of the Vimeo conversion or is it present in the original footage? Guess I should ask the owner.

[net]

It's not tape hiss, it's motor noise and yes, it's still a factor when using the onboard HV mic. Most noticeable in quiet scenes as you might expect.

Obviously NOT a problem with a solid state camera.

I had the HG20 (HDD) and now the HF11 (solid state). The built-in audio sounds exactly the same; horrible. It's not even hiss; it's like a clamoring, sometimes even warbling, noise on everything.

I got the DM-100 mic and the shotgun (mono) setting greatly improves the audio . The other two stereo settings are good, but still have noise. Those settings are suitable for loud music.

I'm thinking that they intentionally cripple the internal mic so that you will buy their proprietary mic.
A couple of years ago, I used a standard def, Panasonic hard drive (not solid state) camcorder. Being that it didn't have an option for an external mic, it seemed they went out of their way to have good audio with the internal, stereo mic - because the audio was pristine. Absolutely no noise at all. No HDD noise or anything.

Based on that, it would seem it's possible to get good audio from an internal mic on a solid state camcorder, but I guess Canon does this to market their DM-100 mic.