Best lowlight prosumer HD camcorder

[ztrain727]

So, is the XH-A1s the best option for low light right now, for its size and weight?

Basically, it seems most HD cam are pretty bad in low light compared to pro SD cams. With more expensive models like the ex1, with bigger sensors, there are improvements, HOWEVER, 1/2" sensor hd cameras are all massive, heavy and impracticable for hand-held shoots.

So with the following things in mind, would anything be a better option than the XH-A1s?

- Good low light
- Relatively compact and light weight (XH-A1 is already pushing it - a bit too big and heavy)
- Good zoom - ideally 20x, though not crucial
- Easy workflow, i.e. no conversion prior to editing - not that my machines can't handle avchd, but I fear the worst when dealing with multicam shoots, etc with an already taxing format to edit
- Of course, good manual control (ideally iris ring), image quality and XLR inputs

Thanks a lot for the help! It seems tough to find really good information out there, though using a few good review sites I'm starting to feel I've got a grasp on the current technology and its limitations.

[Royer Films]

Assuming you want to stick with tape, the Sony FX1000 (prosumer w/o XLRs) or Z5U (professional w/ XLRs) cameras are better in lowlight than an XH A1s in my experience. They are similar size and weight, but I think the Sony's are better designed and balanced better as well. If you want AVCHD, the AX2000 and NX5u are the AVCHD variants of the FX1000 and Z5U. I own an NX5 and I love the tapeless workflow. To me it seems easier to handle than a traditional tape-based workflow like I had before.

[October Black]

You might want to look into the DSLR market if low light is your main concern. This (www.amazon.com/gp/product/B001WAKSCW?ie=UTF8&tag=hv20-20&linkCode=xm2&camp=1789&creativeASIN=B001WAKSCW) is what I use and it's awesome in low light.

[skee]

I use an XHA1 (not the s model, though) and I have found it to be much much better than the HV30 in low light. It can handle darker outdoor shots with little or no gain sometimes, and indoors it does pretty well with some gain. However, I would still recommend getting some sort of cold-shoe mounted light if you are going to be shooting events and stuff since the XHA1 is not THAT good in low light.

As far as weight goes, it is fairly heavy, but I was able to shoot a 5-hour concert handheld and it wasn't unbearable, although I definitely would have like to have a monopod to so I could rest my arm every once in a while.

Hope this helps you at least a little bit..

-Skee

[askclifford]

You want something with a CCD chip. Like the XHA1.

DSLR's are not bad either though

[stealers]

I was about to decide buying the XH A1s until this morning to see this thread. I have the same requirements as the thread starter. But, after reading this thread, browsed about Sony HVR Z5u. Two things I need your opinion - it has 3 CMOS sensors instead of CCD, are CCDs better than CMOS sensors? Should this be my deciding factor?

Second thing, does HVR Z5u has internal mic to record audio? XH A1s has both internal and two external XLR inputs for mic.

Another review says Z5u has SMPTE Time code stamp. Is that right?

Still not able to decide between these two models. Z5u is expensive than A1s, keep aside the few hundred $ but want to get the better one between these two.

[Timbit]

Sony HVR Z5u...it has 3 CMOS sensors instead of CCD, are CCDs better than CMOS sensors? Should this be my deciding factor?

CMOS sensors are by far superior to CCD. In the photography world, DSLRs have CMOS sensors (or the equivalent), whereas point-and-shoot cameras (except for select few) have CCD sensors.

So the clarify, CMOS sensors are better than CCD sensors, hence the higher cost for the Z5u

[cgbier]

CMOS have a few advantages over CCD: The most important is that CMOS are more power efficient, and they are easier (not necessarily cheaper) to produce.
CCD are more light sensitive and have a higher dynamic range. They also were less noisy than CMOS once. However, they might produce some vertical smear from bright light sources. CMOS have the problem with the rolling shutter.

[stealers]

Thanks. Can someone comment on z5u microphone audio?

[cgbier]

It has a mic built in right next to the external mic (under the Sony sticker). But, as usual the sound quality is not the best. For close-up run'n'gun it works, though.

http://provideocoalition.com/images/uploads/Z5-DSC_2595.jpg

[Royer Films]

The Z5u and NX5 also come with a decent shotgun mic, the XHA1 does not. It may not be as good as others that you can buy separately, but personally I like the sound of the included shotgun mic and it's nice that it's a normal XLR mic, not the proprietary connection like Canon uses on their XL H1 mics.

[lobstaman]

I'm in the market for a cam but I'm torn between the z5u and the xha1s. On one had the a1 will be better for the sports and events I do but the z5u PQ looks so nice.

[chozen1one]

I have a Xha1 and cant complain. Everyday I learn new things with it and it seems unlimited. Heres a low light test with one single light very close to the actors, if it helps make up your mind.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j_8QReJZ6IQ

[Lunchbox]

I have XH-A1 and XH-A1s. Just sort of go along with the Canon train. it's not bad in low light but I don't have reference to compare other than HV30 (which I need to use the light trick to lock exposure to use in low light).

One thing for sure if to turn off AGC in XH-A1 and lock exposure with the iris ring.

I also use the Comer 1800 LED light mounted on it. Now I always shoot with -3db or 0db gain. Great footage too.

[cgbier]

The Z5u and NX5 also come with a decent shotgun mic, the XHA1 does not. It may not be as good as others that you can buy separately, but personally I like the sound of the included shotgun mic and it's nice that it's a normal XLR mic, not the proprietary connection like Canon uses on their XL H1 mics.
That mic is the standard Sony edition for prosumer cams. Nothing very special, but not shabby either. Get it off the cam for booming and you get some decent sound.
Disadvantage: It is a short shotgun, so it is not very directional. It works great for for two talking heads if planted between them though.

[askclifford]

...get a rode videomic for that and you will have some not bad directional sound!
Hope this helps!
Will

[cgbier]

Dude, you don't buy a professional camera then connect a Barbie cam mic to it.
If you are so keen on your green cam, then at least add some sense to your advice.

[Royer Films]

Okay...so more on the Z5U vs XH A1s.

For reference, I constantly use an NX5 (Tapeless version of Z5) and an XH A1 (a little bit different than the XH A1s). So not everything is completely the same across these models.

I've found that the Sony is a LOT more comfortable to hold and operate over long periods of time. The Canon has weird weight distribution that causes it to put a majority of the weight to the right. This makes it harder to operate if you are using the top handle instead of the hand grip. The LCD on the Canon is also in a bit of a weird place and is pretty small. With the Sony's LCD placement, you can hold the camera against your shoulder and still be able to focus your eyes on the screen.

The Canon has nicer and a bit more precise control over the zoom speed, but the Sony has shot transition which allows you to do similar work, but in a bit less simple way. The Sony also has only manual mode and auto mode, which I prefer over the Canon's method of having in my opinion way too many unnecessary modes. For a professional camera, having manual/auto makes more sense than many different modes.

The Sony also allows you to use the onboard mic in combination with XLR, while the Canon only allows you to use the XLRs or onboard mic.

But regarding lowlight performance, as the OP asked about, I can tell you from experience that the Sony's (Z5 and NX5) are a LOT cleaner in low light than the Canon XH A1's. In fact, I think the NX5 is the best lowlight cams I've seen in the price range.

All in all, many of these things are small little differences. But when you're constantly using the camera, they add up. I'd definitely pick the Sony over the Canon any day. It may be a bit more expensive, but in my opinion it is worth that difference.

[cgbier]

Ergonomics was never the reason to buy a Canon product.

[jet]

Having tested both this is one case where sony wins by a lot IMO, i have said i will not buy from sony again but if i wanted a big semi prosumer type cam these are good.

[Maxwell]

Having tested both this is one case where sony wins by a lot IMO, i have said i will not buy from sony again but if i wanted a big semi prosumer type cam these are good.

You made Bob Sanders proud. lol

[Timbit]

You made Bob Sanders proud

Hahaha! Where has Bob been?

[jet]

He might not read it with abit of luck,Oh high Bob.

[askclifford]

hah:hv20-smilie87: