The mods ruin these boards...

[tvnewsbadge]

Of course, this is exactly what happens now: newbies start a thread asking a question which I (and anyone else who's been here awhile) have seen often enough we know it's covered in the FAQ or the stickies, and a moderator points them to the existing thread and closes the new one. Seems to work okay. But by all means, if you want to start a "n00bz only" forum, knock yourself out.

.

Actually, it's NOT how it works now. Most of the time the newbie is trashed because he asks a question that bores someone., and when someone finally DOES offer a thread or a faq, it doesn't contain the information needed.

I'm not saying it doesn't '"work". It does to the extent that it discourages newbies or anyone else from seeking information and thereby cuts down on traffic.

Now, I'm not making a value judgment here. I'm not saying this approach is right or wrong I'm just telling it like it is and that is getting information in this forum (and ANY forum )is like pulling teeth and not for the faint hearted or people too weak to ignore the insults they will surely face and let the diatribes roll off their backs.

[MithrilFox]

Some people on these boards have a surprisingly difficult time understanding such a basic concept...

Just be nice to newbies.

It's not hard, but they seem incapable of understanding it. I tried to keep it really basic, but unfortunately human stupidity won over again and people find ways to justify being a@*holes to other people.

[Maxwell]

I think this title should be the other way around "The Noobs ruin these boards." Yes, we all were noobs at a time. But come on guys, I answered the same question probably 4-5 times in the past 2 days. Why do you think that the Mod's are always "saying please do a search". And please stop asking "why did the HV30 go up in price?" This is probably the most asked question ever."Should I get the HV30 or the VIXIA HF S10?" Must be hard being a Mod.

[1]

....human stupidity won over again....

In my next life, I'd like to come back as a MithrilFox. :hv20-smilie77:

[HueyNRolf]

In my next life, I'd like to come back as a MithrilFox. :hv20-smilie77:

Oh you joke about it, but that's exactly what i did.

[1]

Said in classic Napoleon Dynamite style: Lucky!

[MithrilFox]

In my next life, I'd like to come back as a MithrilFox. :hv20-smilie77:

You should be so lucky.

[Rumpelgeist]

So far the hv20.com is heaven compared to some other forums.

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/panasonic-avccam-camcorders/235128-hmc150-im-impatient-get-mine.html


"trusted full line dealers..." - wonder if that's why they edited the title of my post from "b&h is taking forever" to "i'm impatient to get mine" - didn't realize how closely monitored these forums are.

Hey Mal, now when the HV20.com has B&H banner, will you be editing posts that, um, denigrate the advertisers?

[tvnewsbadge]

I think this title should be the other way around "The Noobs ruin these boards." Yes, we all were noobs at a time. But come on guys, I answered the same question probably 4-5 times in the past 2 days. .

My question would be, if it bothers you so much, why did you answer the questions in the first place?
It's not like you're the only one with the answers. If you passed on it, then someone else would jump in.
After all, there are an awful lot of people out there (methinks TOO many people sometimes) who just LOVE an opportunity to share their knowledge.
I just don't see why this is such a big deal to some folks.

[Maxwell]

It doesn't bother me. But the same question over and over again does. Cant you guys at-least look at someone else's thread. And say "Oh wow there's the answer to my question right there." Why this is such a big deal? Hmmmm. Let me think, maybe because the Mods who have to go through all the threads dont want to have to tell people. "Have a look at this thread" or "You need to do a search, I am closing this." You see how this works? It all piles up on the Mods, the people who are not Mods have to help them in some way.

[CycleWriter]

My question would be, if it bothers you so much, why did you answer the questions in the first place?
It's not like you're the only one with the answers. If you passed on it, then someone else would jump in.
After all, there are an awful lot of people out there (methinks TOO many people sometimes) who just LOVE an opportunity to share their knowledge.
I just don't see why this is such a big deal to some folks.

There is so much info that can be found by doing a search. Redundant threads just make the search results more overwhelming and less focused. Still, it should be everyone's first move to do a search before posting. This is a self service forum, not an on demand one.:hv20-smilie77:

[previdman]

Not to mention the noobs don't read the damn stickies or familiarize themselves with proper forum decorum BEFORE asking the same questions. I can't imagine them "wasting" their time even if you color coded the answers so they could find them easier.

It's always easier to make a new post. Somebody will give them the answer. And that is the crux of the issue, right there. So all you "wanna be so helpfuls" out there are actually contributing to the ongoing forum problem, not helping resolve it.

[1]

Hey Mal, now when the HV20.com has B&H banner, will you be editing posts that, um, denigrate the advertisers?


Sort of, yeah.
I've dealt with posts or threads that are unintelligently written, and we do modify titles that are inflammatory.
But in regard to this specific merchant: I've been critical of B&H in the past myself.

I think it all depends on how well the critique is written.

[previdman]

Well written critiques, any subject: $75
Not so well edited shorts: $6

If interested, PM me. :hv20-smilie87:
Previd

[tvnewsbadge]

I When I capture my video in there and then try to put it on vimeo it doesnt find the video because its not the right type of file.

You can find some great information on this forum but it's mainly for breeze shooting and expressing opinions and having fun, not for nuts and bolts real world advice for those new to video.
I've found that for specific questions, the best source is the horse itself.

The Vimeo site itself will tell you the best way to go, as will YouTube, Blip, all of them. Each has their own requirements.

I'd also suggest Creative Cow as a great resource. Since you have to use your own name, you'll find questions are answered, even if others might consider them dumb, no flame or put downs allowed.

As for your question, it sounds like you're trying to upload raw, unedited video...

Not a good idea because even if it would work, it would bore the heck outa most viewers. Only people like myself who have extensive experience shooting film where you had to "edit in the camera" can pull it off, and even folks like me have lost most of those skills over the years. I could not do it(nor would I want to do it ) today without considerable effort and concentration.

I'd suggest this, get yourself a copy of CS4, spend a week learning to do the most basic editing (MUCH longer to get really good at it), go to Vimeo, follow their recommendations as to settings, go to Creative Cow for any tech questions about the software, and get to it.

We'll all be interested to see your first efforts. Good luck.

[CycleWriter]

You can find some great information on this forum but it's mainly for breeze shooting and expressing opinions and having fun, not for nuts and bolts real world advice for those new to video.


Really? And you've reached this conclusion in your 2 months of being a member here? Pity.

[tvnewsbadge]

Really? And you've reached this conclusion in your 2 months of being a member here? Pity.

Well, with all due respect, it didn't take anywhere near two months to reach THAT conclusion.

Don't musunderstand, this is a fun group and serves a purpose it that it gives folks who share a common hobby a place to go and shoot the breeze.

But, by design, this group doesn't seem to have much patience with newcomers to the world of video seeking basic information.

Check out Creative Cow and the way they handle "newbie" questions and I'm 100 percent confident you'll agree that my observation is valid.

[CycleWriter]

But, by design, this group doesn't seem to have much patience with newcomers to the world of video seeking basic information.That's completely different from what I quoted from your earlier post. There is a ton of "nuts and bolts" info as well as a ton of DIY to be had in here.


Check out Creative Cow and the way they handle "newbie" questions and I'm 100 percent confident you'll agree that my observation is valid.
I would submit that the main difference between us and CC is that they are trying to sell you something. They have to be nicer to newbies. We are unencumbered by such nonsense. :hv20-smilie84:

[tvnewsbadge]

That's completely different from what I quoted from your earlier post. There is a ton of "nuts and bolts" info as well as a ton of DIY to be had in here.
And that's exactly what I said in my first post. An example would be the very informative thread I saw lately about how to recycle empty food containers into rather natty lens hoods for the HV series... Prime stuff for advanced users, but not the kind of advice that will help this young fella who is trying to upload raw video to Vimeo.


would submit that the main difference between us and CC is that they are trying to sell you something. They have to be nicer to newbies. We are unencumbered by such nonsense. :hv20-smilie84:

I honestly don't understand your beef here. Throw out the bogus charge about Creative Cow trying to "sell you something" and according to your own words here, we're in total agreement that Creative Cow is a better place for newbies seeking nuts and bolts basic information then this forum is.

You say yourself that being nice to the Informationally Challenged is "nonsence".

We're on the same page here,son. We both agree that Creative Cow is better for the newcomers who tend to ask the same questions us experts have heard a thousand times or for folks who don't want to get flamed and this forum is better for folk who have conquered the basics and now want shoot some breeze and share some tips and experiences.

Re-read my original post and I'm sure you'll agree.

[CycleWriter]

There is plenty of info for all ranges of users in this forum. Your dismissal of the "trying to sell you something" aspect of CC misses the point. They can afford to be more accommodating of the dolts who barge through the door without reading the FAQ or doing a search and start whining for help. They have a product to sell and people paid to help them. We are a forum that depends entirely on the volunteerism of its staff and members. As such, we owe it to those helpfull people to not let the forum become overrun with disrespectful people who do not want to follow our few simple rules. We also owe it to our membership to not let the forum get stale with the same, tired subjects being rehashed over and over again for the benefit of every newb that comes through the door. Especially when that info is already here and available with just a modicum of effort on the part of the newb.

And unlike CC, we do not harvest e-mail addresses for the purpose of spamming your inbox with e-mails from us or our strategic partners.

[oddmanil]

I've been on CC's Sony Vegas forum for some months, and never been spamed. Not even got an advise to buy something.

On the other hand, take a look at the Administator's signatur.

[mrblofish]

ahhh lovely sunday morning....and as usual I get up...whiz..brush teeth...then check the new posts...

seems like there's loads of thin skinned hv20/30 users like myself that need/want/desire info and have ventured here.....

I personally lurked for 2 weeks before I joined...took that time to kinda research info and learn the do's and don'ts ... and figure out the personalities on the forum as well as procedures for participating and properly using features....(the information I needed wasn't an emergency)....and this IMO is the basic mistake made by new users....the "I NEED THIS INFORMATION YESTERDAY" syndrome so I don't really have the time to figure out all this forum procedure mumbo jumbo...reading the FAQS and searching threads is tedious and time consuming before I post ...and rarely does life work this way when you aren't spending money.....

like when a hwy patrolman pulls you over and asks that first question.."do you know why I'm stopping you sir?" although on most occasions I do know...my response is always the same..."no officer"....although I know exactly why he/she is pulling me over...the speed limit was clearly posted...I saw the sign and disobeyed.....I had been glancing at the speedometer every few seconds as I usually do when driving saw my speed and didn't slow to the limit... I KNOW I WAS DELIBERATELY SPEEDING...but then I lie..... I act innocent...then offended....then belligerent ...

unlike this forum...its a face to face discussion and usually the officer witnessed the offense and his radar gun holds the evidence....and god forbid he has a dash cam...

like this forum ignorance of the law is NOT an excuse....

I look at it like this.....I would be more insulted if the moderators didn't deal with repetitive posts and incorrect posting in the way they do with everyone including myself...because I took the time to search threads glance at the FAQs and consider before I posted everyone else should be held to that standard as well....

caio...gonna go film something

[CycleWriter]

Thank you, Mrblofish. Now there's someone that gets it. If I didn't say it before, welcome to the forum.:hv20-smilie77:

[Maxwell]

Maybe we should learn how to spell signature? Hahah nice try though.

[ncusa367]

]the stickied posts are just a jumbled mess of information. Why don't you spend the time and take the info that is within 12 pages and compile it into one? Instead you tell everyone to wade through the crap yourself.

While I disagree mostly with whipsmack (I love HV20.com:hv20-smilie31:) hes got a point about messy stickys. They are huge and hard to find information in.

I still support this forum adding a wiki feature for more organized information

[CycleWriter]

Let's see...the info is here for free if you take the time to look for it. But you want us unpaid volunteers to do the work for you and make your lives easier. Makes perfect sense.:hv20-smilie45:

[Maxwell]

Haaha you got it CW! No, just messing.

[tvnewsbadge]

And yes I realize you all volunteer your time to answer questions here,

With all due respect to management, I don't see any of them "volunteering their time to answer questions here".

It's been my observation that the answers are coming from people like you and me while 90 percent of what you get from management is "go away son, you bother me".

I have serious problems with the word "volunteering" too. No one is "volunteering" ANYTHING in this forum. They're here because they get something out of it... NOT out of a desire to help others.

Just to be clear, I don't have a dog in this hunt, just telling it like it is.

[mrblofish]

With all due respect to management, I don't see any of them "volunteering their time to answer questions here".

It's been my observation that the answers are coming from people like you and me while 90 percent of what you get from management is "go away son, you bother me".

I have serious problems with the word "volunteering" too. No one is "volunteering" ANYTHING in this forum. They're here because they get something out of it... NOT out of a desire to help others.

Just to be clear, I don't have a dog in this hunt, just telling it like it is.
LOL... ignorance is bliss I guess...

[koolpenguin89]

tvnewsbadge, what is it that you assume i get out of moderating this forum?

Dylan

[CycleWriter]

With all due respect to management, I don't see any of them "volunteering their time to answer questions here".

It's been my observation that the answers are coming from people like you and me while 90 percent of what you get from management is "go away son, you bother me".

I have serious problems with the word "volunteering" too. No one is "volunteering" ANYTHING in this forum. They're here because they get something out of it... NOT out of a desire to help others.

Just to be clear, I don't have a dog in this hunt, just telling it like it is.

You are so wrong it isn't funny. Much of what I do around here is in silence. Moving/deleting threads to maintain some semblance of order, cleaning up threads with useless posts. Then there are the replies I make that have actual help, not just admonishments. Some of the other mods are just as active and helpful. If you have so much disdain for this place, why keep coming back? There are a lot more takers than givers in here. Insulting anyone that helps, whatever their motivation, is just plain rude.:mad:

[CycleWriter]

tvnewsbadge, what is it that you assume i get out of moderating this forum?

Dylan
We must be padding our resume's.:hv20-smilie45:

[tvnewsbadge]

tvnewsbadge, what is it that you assume i get out of moderating this forum?

Dylan

I don't know you, so you're better qualified to speak on your SPECIFIC motivation than I am, but in GENERAL, people who seek power do so because they're hot to get a title and/or authority over other people and/or (as Cyclewriter pointed out) to pad their resumes.

That's just a general observation, mind you, that covers 90 percent of the cases, your mileage may differ.

[1]

That's just a general observation, mind you, that covers 90 percent of the cases...

Well, I for one, think you're 100% accurate.
I always brag about my achievements and position on here. I've even made T-Shirts stating this, and mention it to whomever I speak.


I know all the mods are the same, because that's exactly why they were chosen; for their power-hungry persona. I think most of them
(including me) tried out to be cops, but we all failed the psychological tests. Being a mod on hv20.com was the next best thing.
All mods were even sent a star-shaped "HV20.com Moderator Badge", in nice looking brass; as well as a six-shooter.

You have excellent investigative and observational skills!
You should be a journalist!

:hv20-smilie81:

[tvnewsbadge]

Then there are the replies I make that have actual help, not just admonishments.

That may or may not be true, but I have no way of knowing since I only read the threads on topics that interest me and that doesn't seem to be the pattern to me.



Some of the other mods are just as active and helpful.
You'll note that you used the word "some", not "all" or even "most". That indicates that your don't entirely disagree with some of the observations in this thread regarding "mods" in general.


There are a lot more takers than givers in here.

I not only strongly disagree with that statement, I find it highly insulting to the vast majority of members of this forum. The base membership of this forum is just about the most helpful group you'll find anywhere. They are the people who make this forum worthwhile and instead of insulting them, you should be grateful they are willing to do you the favor of their business and just say "Thank You".

[koolpenguin89]

I don't know you, so you're better qualified to speak on your SPECIFIC motivation than I am, but in GENERAL, people who seek power do so because they're hot to get a title and/or authority over other people and/or (as Cyclewriter pointed out) to pad their resumes.

That's just a general observation, mind you, that covers 90 percent of the cases, your mileage may differ.

Umm, this is a direct, unnedited quote from your post. Emphasis in bold.


No one is "volunteering" ANYTHING in this forum. They're here because they get something out of it

Dylan

[CycleWriter]

That may or may not be true, but I have no way of knowing since I only read the threads on topics that interest me and that doesn't seem to be the pattern to me.Yet you felt qualified to make generalized statements about how the mods operate in here.


You'll note that you used the word "some", not "all" or even "most". That indicates that your don't entirely disagree with some of the observations in this thread regarding "mods" in general.Despite your nefarious insinuations, I said "some" because there are a number of mods in good standing that no longer participate regularly for one reason or another. The bulk of the work is being done by a handful of us these days. And yes, I totally disagree with you.


I not only strongly disagree with that statement, I find it highly insulting to the vast majority of members of this forum. The base membership of this forum is just about the most helpful group you'll find anywhere. They are the people who make this forum worthwhile and instead of insulting them, you should be grateful they are willing to do you the favor of their business and just say "Thank You".Ooooh...highly insulting. Just like you took it upon yourself to speak in generalities for the entire forum, you now take umbrage for them collectively. How droll. there was nothing insidious about what I said. If there weren't more people in need than people ready to help, the forum would grind to a halt. That doesn't mean that the place is not filled with genuinely helpful people, it just means that this place's existence is predicated on people needing it. Nothing more. You should spend less time trying to define what people mean because you sure suck at it.:hv20-smilie84:

[iThinkergoiMac]

I not only strongly disagree with that statement, I find it highly insulting to the vast majority of members of this forum. The base membership of this forum is just about the most helpful group you'll find anywhere. They are the people who make this forum worthwhile and instead of insulting them, you should be grateful they are willing to do you the favor of their business and just say "Thank You".

I was going to stay out of this, but I feel like I need to weigh in here. If you look at the bottom of the home page, you will see that there are 22,072 members and, out of them, 2,799 "active members". I'm not sure what defines an "active member" but I have a feeling it has to do with some sort of cutoff as to how recent the user's most recent post is. Now, in my observance, there are givers and takers on here. The givers offer advice and try to help solve problems, and the takers are here to have their problems fixed. There's nothing wrong with being a taker. Also under takers would be those who leave snide comments and don't really contribute anything.

Now, as a generous guesstimate I would say there's probably... 50 or so givers on this board. That's less than 2% of the active members. Even if the number is closer to 100, that's still less than 4% of the active members. So, yes, there are some very helpful people on here, but you cannot say it is the majority. If you actually look at most members, I would say they've got 2-20 posts, probably about their one problem, and then they're gone again until they have another problem. Again, there's nothing wrong with this, especially when they're nice about it.

We've got to give the mods credit. This is a high-traffic board (22,000+ members? Like managing a small city). How many thousands (literally, thousands) of times have the mods had to go through pointless posts that could have easily been solved by reading the FAQs? Sure, they're cumbersome, but I've been able to get the info out of them that I need. If I can do it, so can other people, many of them just aren't willing to take the time. So I say hats off to the mods. They're not perfect, but who is? They make mistakes and are sometimes jerks, but aren't all of us? We just see it in the mods more because they're more active. The fact that they keep going despite the heat says a lot about them.

[Maxwell]

Hey Ty I didnt find his comment Highly Insulting I think that you were the only one that did. Do you honestly think that you will win against the Mods? I dont thinkso. Think of it like this when you come on the site the Mods are "Gods". You please them its all good, you mess around. Know that's just a big "No, No". Ahhh classic Mal.

[booggerg]

To the OP: seriously dude.. who the hell cares.. it's just another internet forum.. not like it's your only outlet to talk about video and crap... just go somewhere else.

[tvnewsbadge]

I They're not perfect, but who is? They make mistakes and are sometimes jerks, but aren't all of us? We just see it in the mods more because they're more active. .

I agree with you in general, but I have to wonder about a mod who picks as an Avatar something which by design and intent to is meant to be insulting and intimidating to the tender minded newcomer to the the world of video.

I certainly understand better than any one else in this forum the need to establish and keep group discipline, but when someone iintentionally goes out of his way to present a negative face up front ? Well, maybe you can respect that, I can't.

[Erik Bien]

I certainly understand better than any one else in this forum


http://teamsubmarine.files.wordpress.com/2009/04/upe30e51.jpg

"See, right here's your problem ..."

[1]

...I have to wonder about a mod who picks as an Avatar something which by design and intent to is meant to be insulting and intimidating.

I love how people beat around the bush; if you find koolpenguin89's South Park inspired avatar so darn offensive, why didn't you just say so in the beginning?

:hv20-smilie01:

[tvnewsbadge]

I love how people beat around the bush; if you find koolpenguin89's South Park inspired avatar so darn offensive, why didn't you just say so in the beginning?

:hv20-smilie01:

Gee, just shy I guess.

[tvnewsbadge]

Think of it like this when you come on the site the Mods are "Gods". You please them its all good, you mess around. Know that's just a big "No, No". Ahhh classic Mal.

Of course, this thread is all in fun and no one is expected to take it seriously (witness the liberal use of smiley emoticons), but I get the impression you DO (take it seriously).
As a topnotch student of human nature, I'm curious as to why you consider the"mods" to be "Gods", with a cap "g" no less.

If I were to characterize them, the first thing that comes to my mind is the Omegas in "Animal House" ( a movie about college life), not a deity.

I'd be very interesting in hearing your rationale, your point of view is certainly unique.

[mrblofish]

I agree with you in general, but I have to wonder about a mod who picks as an Avatar something which by design and intent to is meant to be insulting and intimidating to the tender minded newcomer to the the world of video.

I certainly understand better than any one else in this forum the need to establish and keep group discipline, but when someone iintentionally goes out of his way to present a negative face up front ? Well, maybe you can respect that, I can't.


I think P.DIDDY said it best ...lotta BIT$H@$$NESS going on....Dr. J Couldn't have done a better reverse layup....

I prefer the OVeRT to the COVeRT....

his avatar plus his title as MOD speaks for itself...

its like the difference between a salivating pit bull head down growlin low... and a pit bull head up tail and tongue wagging....

EITHER way they both BITE LIKE PITBULLS...just DIFFERENT advertising....

I really can't figure most of the emotional malfunctions 'round here...I sometimes have to just chalk it up to "the sensitive artist" in all of us..

and lay off the teenager...he needs encouragement and room to grow...

[tvnewsbadge]

EITHER way they both BITE LIKE PITBULLS..
I'd say more like pomeranians, don't ya think?

[koolpenguin89]

Sorry guys, i wasn't aware that my avatar depicting characters from a cartoon. Im looking for an avatar now that will be sure not to offend anyone. Ill upload it when i find it.

Dylan

EDIT: Ah, there we are. Nice and unoffensive. Plus it matches the forums color scheme.

[mrblofish]

I'd say more like pomeranians, don't ya think?

nah ...... the pitbull analogy wasn't me comparing the MODs to pitbulls.....

now the pomeranians dig ...thats your story....

I ain't NEVER been afraid of getting bit by a pomeranian nor a MOD for that matter...now a pitbull....thats my story:hv20-smilie24:

[Maxwell]

Why I consider the "Mods" to be "Gods" because they control everything. Think of it like Ancient Mythology. Mal is like Zues, and etc.

[1]

Mal is like [Zeus]...


More like Chimera, really.

[Eugenia Loli-Queru]

This thread is silly. 13 pages of nothingness. Blah, blah, blah.

[CycleWriter]

Sorry guys, i wasn't aware that my avatar depicting characters from a cartoon. Im looking for an avatar now that will be sure not to offend anyone. Ill upload it when i find it.

Dylan

EDIT: Ah, there we are. Nice and unoffensive. Plus it matches the forums color scheme.

I'm just glad no one brought up MY avatar.:hv20-smilie68:

[CycleWriter]

This thread is silly. 13 pages of nothingness. Blah, blah, blah.

Hey, maybe we could make a TV series out it? You know, like Seinfeld! A forum about nothing!:hv20-smilie84:

[tvnewsbadge]

I said "some" because there are a number of mods in good standing that no longer participate regularly for one reason or another. The bulk of the work is being done by a handful of us these days.:

That raises another serious question, if these "mods" "no longer participate" as you charge, why for heaven's sake are they STILL MODS?
That'smore than passing strange, if you ask me.

[CycleWriter]

That raises another serious question, if these "mods" "no longer participate" as you charge, why for heaven's sake are they STILL MODS?
That'smore than passing strange, if you ask me.

Tell me again who the heck are you and why do you think yourself in a position to question how we operate this forum?

[Dodgy Nick]

I may not post much, but I'm always lurking and fixing things behind the scenes :hv20-smilie03:

[CycleWriter]

I may not post much, but I'm always lurking and fixing things behind the scenes :hv20-smilie03:

Too bad that apparently has no value to at least one member. The rest of us appreciate your contributions, though.:hv20-smilie77:

[1]

That raises another serious question...

Yes, very SERIOUS indeed.
Ranks right up there with world hunger!

[CycleWriter]

I'm getting a Mithril vibe from this one.:hv20-smilie84:

[tvnewsbadge]

why do you think yourself in a position to question how we operate this forum?

Oh no, you misunderstand. I never tell anyone how to do anything. You'll hear no value judgments from me.
I simply offer my well considered observations on the way things appear to be and ask respectful questions as to why things are the way they are.

Do you really feel it's so unreasonable, for example, to ask why someone who by your own admission doesn't participate, continues to reap the benefits of modism? Especially where that lack of activity increases your own workload to the point where it's apparently become burdensome?

Or to question the use of an avatar clearly designed to intimidate newcomers?

I'm not telling anyone how to do anything. I'm simply putting, in a respectful manner, honest observations and questions out there for clarification and consideration.

[1]

...for clarification and consideration.

Consider it clarified and considered.

"Next!"

[iThinkergoiMac]

I never tell anyone how to do anything.

Never say never! :hv20-smilie31:


Or to question the use of an avatar clearly designed to intimidate newcomers?

Huh... when I was a newcomer I can't say I ever felt intimidated by it. Guess it's not designed well enough! :hv20-smilie87:

[halrlee]

Quick question. One of CW's main goals is to provide clean search results. I don't know anything (really) about vBulletin but I was wonder if there was a way that a duplicitous thread could be marked as non-indexed so it won't show up in the search results. I know that it will be removed eventually but just curious if there was a way to play with the search index so that you could control the results.
I think that the super thread idea has the same problem as the regular threads in that if someone doesn't bother to search for the regular thread then they really won't search for the super thread either.

[iThinkergoiMac]

I think that the super thread idea has the same problem as the regular threads in that if someone doesn't bother to search for the regular thread then they really won't search for the super thread either.

Sticky and regular threads both come up in a search. While it's probably possible to search only sticky or regular, that definitely isn't on by default.

I still think the Wiki is the best option, but hard to do.

[koolpenguin89]

What exactly would making the wiki entail? I don't really know what everyone wants out of it. I've got a lot of time on my hands, maybe if people were to actually say what they wanted out of a wiki page i might look into it. So far all i've heard is "their should be a wiki page!".

Dylan

P.S. I had meant to take this avatar down, but i forgot that my old one is on my old computer, so it'll have to stay until i can find a way to replace it.

[iThinkergoiMac]

Essentially, a Wiki would involve getting some Wiki software and hosting it, and then the people involved in the project would have to go through information in the stickies and other threads of each forum and condense the critical information into concentrated paragraphs and sections, essentially removing the extraneous comments and whatnot. This would be done by just a select group of people until it was finished enough to be made public. At that point, we would open up the Wiki for public (or more likely, registered user) editing. You would likely want to keep most of the people on board to patrol and edit the wiki as necessary to keep it clean and precise, as well as maintaining a flow.

You could probably organize the Wiki in much the same way that the forum is organized.

[blondandfun]

Essentially, a Wiki would involve getting some Wiki software and hosting it, and then the people involved in the project would have to go through information in the stickies and other threads of each forum and condense the critical information into concentrated paragraphs and sections, essentially removing the extraneous comments and whatnot. This would be done by just a select group of people until it was finished enough to be made public. At that point, we would open up the Wiki for public (or more likely, registered user) editing. You would likely want to keep most of the people on board to patrol and edit the wiki as necessary to keep it clean and precise, as well as maintaining a flow.

You could probably organize the Wiki in much the same way that the forum is organized.

wiki this:hv20-smilie14:

[1]

wiki:
I'm about as fed up with wiki as b&f is.

wiki wiki wiki....

We've had dozens of suggestions regarding wiki, and no one to do it.

It's a lot of work for something that's not long lasting and quite futile.

I'm about to add "wiki" to the words that we censor:

lalalala this :hv20-smilie14:

[Duke]

A wiki is a sticky by another name. Making them click to say they read it is not the same as actually having them read it. :hv20-smilie119:

[tvnewsbadge]

condense the critical information into concentrated paragraphs and sections, essentially removing the extraneous comments and whatnot.

Exactly. That would fix the major problem with this forum today... you can't find nothin' because of the way it's (dis)organized, so folks new to the world of HV30 video get frustrated trying to find answers by using the search process and result to asking questions directly which apparently irrates some folk no end.

Having all the information readily available would solve that problem and would leave everybody happy.

And it should be pointed out that this would only need to be done once, and one or two "mods' should be able to accomplish it in short order.

[mrblofish]

Exactly. That would fix the major problem with this forum today... you can't find nothin' because of the way it's (dis)organized, so folks new to the world of HV30 video get frustrated trying to find answers by using the search process and result to asking questions directly which apparently irrates some folk no end.

Having all the information readily available would solve that problem and would leave everybody happy.

And it should be pointed out that this would only need to be done once, and one or two "mods' should be able to accomplish it in short order.

LOL....I vote you take the time to put it all together make sure it works to your standards and then start your forum with your version included...and SHOW US ALL HOW ITS DONE......:hv20-smilie77: WHEN ORGANIZED CORRECTLY BY YOU...:hv20-smilie77:

[tvnewsbadge]

LOL....I vote you take the time to put it all together make sure it works to your standards and then start your forum with your version included...and SHOW US ALL HOW ITS DONE......:hv20-smilie77: WHEN ORGANIZED CORRECTLY BY YOU...:hv20-smilie77:

I'd be glad to, but I've got a lot on my plate right now, and would not be able to tackle the project until November at the earliest.

But seriously, it wouldn't take that long.
You figure that there's maybe less than a couple dozen questions that new kids on the block are apt to ask repeatedly, so day or two of intense effort by two or three dudes or dudettes would clean things up nicely.

Once a couple of folk dive on in and get to it, I'm confident they'll find it's not time consuming at all.

[mrblofish]

I'd be glad to, but I've got a lot on my plate right now

ahhhhhh...but no so much that you don't take a bit of that (spare) time and energy to figure that you can spend it in here denigrating other peoples work and effort...u r hilarious


Once a couple of folk dive on in and get to it, I'm confident they'll find it's not time consuming at all.

well when you free up in November...I'll be here waiting to hear how that project is progressing....:hv20-smilie77:

[net]

I don't know if it's possible with the interface they have (for the mods) or even if this site would want this...
..but maybe if there were a way to certify an answer as correct by tagging an individual post with some icon that would reveal a best answer when someone is going through the threads after a search....
This tagging would only be performed by mods/admins, who wouldn't necessarily have to take the time to go through all previous threads - but mainly just tagging answers as "certified correct" on the fly, so that when somebody reads through a thread, the extraneous comments would still be there but the correct/or best answer would be labeled.

Perhaps it could be done if there is a way to enable ratings-per-post (stars), but disable ratings-per-post for the (non-mod) average user...(that would be per-post, not per-thread rating).
...maybe 5 stars would be excellent answer, 4 very good, 3 acceptable, etc.
...or, probably more straight forward, just have all correct answers answer rated as 5 stars and make a sticky or message on search page explaining what a 5 star post means. A rated or certified correct post would always be there, regardless of whether it was found through a search or not.

For example:

http://i40.tinypic.com/1z35tl4.jpg

Thinking the stars, because maybe a per-post rating is already in the system(?)
The basic idea would be so that most of the answers would eventually be tagged, but no rush to tag them right away/unless a mod feels like going out of their way to tag a post/answer.

EDIT:

I just did a search for vBulletin per-post rating:
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla%3Aen-US%3Aofficial&q=vBulletin+per-post+rating&btnG=Search&aq=f&oq=&aqi=

And I can see it's possible (although I don;t know how you incorporate it to a site).

here's a result:
SAPR: Advanced Post Rating system (ajax)
http://www.vbulletin.org/forum/showthread.php?t=170419

Which says on the page:

This adds a thumbs up/down post rating system: youtube style.

But wait there's more!
It not only adds a post rating system that works with and without ajax, but it also adds options to filter posts (on-the-flow with javascript) based on that rating.

That way your users will be able to browse easier trough threads by setting a filter, which collapses posts under a certain rating.
It also will prevent users of flooding you're site with 3 word posts.

AND THERE'S STILL MORE! It also adds a system of 'good posts', you can set a value of what is considered as a good post, and if a post reaches this value, the author gets +1 on his good post score.
So you get to see: this user has 500 posts and 150 good posts.

AND IF THAT ISN'T ENOUGH: it's also completely configurable through the admincp.

So, there are possibilities with that/with what I was suggesting.

There's also this one:

Geek Realtime Amporphic Modnotes Per-post System 1.0
http://www.vbulletin.org/forum/showthread.php?t=91923


And probably a bunch more...

[tvnewsbadge]

well when you free up in November...I'll be here waiting to hear how that project is progressing....:hv20-smilie77:

Hummmm, you're just funnin' but come to think of it, it just might be an interesting project from a "showcase" or "proof of concept" perspective. It'd certainly be helpful to the newcomers here.
Of course, there isn't time right now , but come Fall, once my summer opii are in the can, who knows?

[1]

...but maybe if there were a way to certify an answer as correct by tagging an individual post with some icon that would reveal a best answer

Now there's a FANTASTIC, and constructive idea!

I'll start by giving you some green, after which I'll keep this in mind and search for a modification to this forum software.

Kudos!

[1]

...you can't find nothin'...

So, you can find something then? Double negative...



]I'd be glad to, but I've got a lot on my plate right now...

Hmm. Where have I heard that before?
Oh yeah: from everyone else who suggests a wiki!
It's only good if someone ELSE does the work...

[net]

Now there's a FANTASTIC, and constructive idea!

I'll start by giving you some green, after which I'll keep this in mind and search for a modification to this forum software.

Kudos!

Cool, glad you liked it. I should have just searched first..just Googled it now and it came up right away (edited my other post).

Thanks for the greens! :hv20-smilie77:

[1]

Done, and installed.

Except for the images of the thumbs up and down, it looks good.

[net]

Done, and installed.

Except for the images of the thumbs up and down, it looks good.

wow..that was fast...

Don't you want it so that only mods (or a trusted person) can rate a post/so that the best answer can be found through the many posts, especially after a search?

In other words, only the posts with a green thumb would be considered correct/an answer as designated by a mod as such...there would be no other opinion thumbs or red thumbs besides a select number of green thumbs - which would mean it's a correct answer.

So, if you have a thread with 50 posts..as you scroll down you might see three thumbs.. someone reading the thread will know that it's been marked by someone who knows it's right...but it can only be given a green thumb by a mod or person you (Mal) trusts to rate answers.

And they'll mark them as they get around to it or happen to see a correct answer in a thread...as the months/years go on, they will accumulate.

Anyway, that's what I originally meant.

[mrblofish]

Done, and installed.

Except for the images of the thumbs up and down, it looks good.

WOW...maybe Max was closer to the truth than we suspect....maybe this is Asgard and you are ODIN:hv20-smilie55:

[1]

Don't you want it so that mods...

Yeah, I know; but I'm never too keen on something that gives more work to.....me!

Let's try this for a while, and see what happens.

I do like your idea better, but it will be tricky to implement.
Maybe this is a good compromise.

[iThinkergoiMac]

Awesome idea... this could be helpful, I'm sure.

[venture]

I don't know if this has been mentioned in the 14 prior pages (I did a search, but wasn't sure what terms to use . . . ), but I've seen other vBulletin boards that start suggesting other posts to review as you type a new post. The suggestions appear just below the input box. I imagine that has to cut down on many of the repeat inquiries, but I don't know if this costs money, is easy to install, etc.

[Maxwell]

Post has been Deleted.

[1]

Winner of the dumbest-idea award!!!

:hv20-smilie70::hv20-smilie70::hv20-smilie70::hv20-smilie70::hv20-smilie70::hv20-smilie70::hv20-smilie70::hv20-smilie70::hv20-smilie70::hv20-smilie70::hv20-smilie70::hv20-smilie70:

[Maxwell]

thank you very much!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[1]

You know i can bring that post back, right?
:)

[Maxwell]

Mal, why dont get all the mods to insult me?

[Seo]

Look, you can just leave. You don't have to act all hurt. Like I said before, self-pity doesn't make things any better.

[HueyNRolf]

Anyone subscribed to a thread can read posts as written, before editing or deletion, in their email alerts.

That's how I know what Braceface used to write about me (and others) before he thought better of it :hv20-smilie03:

[iThinkergoiMac]

Anyone subscribed to a thread can read posts as written, before editing or deletion, in their email alerts.

That's how I know what Braceface used to write about me (and others) before he thought better of it :hv20-smilie03:

Indeed. I've had that happen, where someone (on a different board, I believe) really laid into me, and then when I went to the actual post, he was actually pretty nice. And I couldn't figure it out... then I saw the "edited by" tag and I knew.

[Lunchbox]

I think that we should have a new policy. All guests have to sign up to this forum. And for the 1st month they have to an average of 3 posts per day. If they don't do that there account is *terminated* After the 1st month they have to do at least 2 posts per day. Its not that hard to do that. Then all members with 0-100 posts have to post at least 4 things a day. Members with 200-400 posts would have to do 5 posts. Members with 400- and beyond. I have to do at least 6 posts a day. If a member fails to do that *terminated account*. We need more members and we need more posts. And encase you guys haven't noticed we have double the guests than members.

That's just what I think. What do you guys think?


What I think is glad you are not the board owner. We need quality posts, not someone post something stupid to fulfill the 3 posts a day requirement.

[VideJo]

As a beginner and after reading all stickeys and after gathering all the information that is in there, I do not think you will be succesful to achieve that goal. Honestly.

[Maxwell]

As a beginner and after reading all stickeys and after gathering all the information that is in there, I do not think you will be succesful to achieve that goal. Honestly.

Yeah, I know. Im laughing at my own Idea right now. Welcome the HV30 Nazi Forum! :hv20-smilie84:

[CycleWriter]

There's only room for one Nazi in here.:hv20-smilie68:

[VideJo]

I was beeing serious. I doubt, whether the postings requirement is realistic. I can live with the fact, that the mods do not like to participate in a live chat about this over here, but please give this matter a second thought.

[Maxwell]

There's only room for one Nazi in here.:hv20-smilie68:

Ohhhhhh Yeahhhhhhh. Haha. :hv20-smilie77:

[iThinkergoiMac]

I was beeing serious. I doubt, whether the postings requirement is realistic. I can live with the fact, that the mods do not like to participate in a live chat about this over here, but please give this matter a second thought.

Right, I don't think anyone is actually considering that it might be a good idea. It's not a good idea, and doesn't make much sense.

[Maxwell]

Right, I don't think anyone is actually considering that it might be a good idea. It's not a good idea, and doesn't make much sense.

Well its not a good idea. I guess you didnt see what Mal said or what Taky said? :hv20-smilie81:

Can you guys imagine a revolution on the forum? Hahaha.

[BWC]

I started a thread in the PC software forum asking what the differences were between Premiere CS3 and CS4. I was looking for feedback and discussion about the main differences and whether or not consensus is that it is a necessary upgrade. Before posting, I searched the forums and found that , on HV20.com, there was no comparison of CS4 and CS3, no comprehensive list of added/changed features, and no discussions as to whether or not the upgrade is essential to users. Having done the suggested checking in advance, I posted my thread.

Today I went back to check on the thread and found it locked. When I clicked on it to see what the deal was, this was the only reply:


Do some google search. That stuff have been covered everywhere, and in detail.

Now, I understand and appreciate that the rules of the board are that we must search the forum before posting to avoid multiple threads on the same topic, but am I to understand that we are not to post anything that you can find on Google either? If so, why not lock all threads outside The Pub, DIY, and Trade and Exchange? I did do a Google search and the CS3/CS4 comparisons I saw are general overviews on the entire suite. All I am concerned with is Premiere.

I do not care to read bloggers rehashing Adobe's press release. I do not care to read what people who don't work primarily in video thought about Premiere CS4 at a glance when it was brand new. What I was after was what the users of THIS FORUM who use the same camera that I use, who have used previous versions of Premiere with that camera, and who's opinions I have learned to trust had to say about it after having used it for a while.

The message this sends is that now, even if the information is not on this forum, you shouldn't post a question about it if you could find information about it through a Google search. In that Google search, the only links I found that were Premiere specific were to other forums like DVInfo, Creative Cow, etc. Am I to take it that if someone has no direct knowledge of something, rather than posting it here, they should use Google to search for the forums that have that information, read that forum, and post any remaining questions there? Seriously, I not trying to go all Mithril on the subject, but I was extremely taken aback by this; especially in light of threads like these remaining unlocked and active:

What really is the best setup to go for 35mm (http://www.hv20.com/showthread.php?t=12412)

Best adapter for cinematic Bokeh (http://www.hv20.com/showthread.php?t=25400)

Difference between manual focus ring and 35mm adapter? (http://www.hv20.com/showthread.php?t=28601)

I have a Letus Extreme- now what size rings? (http://www.hv20.com/showthread.php?t=26818)

35mm adapters and infinity focus (http://www.hv20.com/showthread.php?t=28455)

Is Instant Auto Focus blocked by lens hood? (http://www.hv20.com/showthread.php?t=28453)

help help about the right workflow pleasee (http://www.hv20.com/showthread.php?t=28287)

wats the biggest lens hood that will go onto an hv40? (http://www.hv20.com/showthread.php?t=28092)

Opteka front thread size? (http://www.hv20.com/showthread.php?t=27737)

What Rail system to buy (http://www.hv20.com/showthread.php?t=27796)

How do I Film Upside Down? (http://www.hv20.com/showthread.php?t=27831&highlight=film+upside)

How to choose the right 35mm adapter? Pros and cons? (http://www.hv20.com/showthread.php?t=27643)

HV20ACHR1 VS. TwoneilPlus+ (http://www.hv20.com/showthread.php?t=27585)

Can't DECIDE: Twoneil vs JAG35 (http://www.hv20.com/showthread.php?t=27539)

Any DIY 35mm Adapter compatible with EF? (http://www.hv20.com/showthread.php?t=27477)

What external battery charger? (http://www.hv20.com/showthread.php?t=116)

Nikon lenses on HV30 (http://www.hv20.com/showthread.php?t=28293)

None of those threads which have been covered ad-nauseum on this forum were locked. I have never before seen anyone told to search Google instead of posting here. Even in the most reduntant of the threads I have linked to here, the worst that happens is CW tells them, in his distinctive style, to search the forums. On the average, various mods simply suggest that the OP search the forum and they often provide a link. No matter how redundant the topic, Eugenia herself would never lock a thread if she had a related blog to link. I am at a loss for the reasoning in this situation and, after posting a thread here and searching google, am no closer to having answers to my question.

[CycleWriter]

When it comes to different versions of software and comparisons of their features, we tend to not want to duplicate what can almost always be found on the developer's website. This is primarily a camera forum. We have software subforums as an adjunct since they go hand-in-hand with using the cameras, but some things are better left to the developer's websites to deal with. Had you asked about a specific feature or difference or for help with it, I doubt the thread would have been locked, but we routinely close threads asking about info that is readily available direct from the horse's mouth. Don't take it personal.

EDIT: Actually, do take it personal. I just looked at your question and I gave you far more credit in my reply above than you deserved. All you asked was, "Premiere CS3 and CS4. What's the differences?" Eugenia was right to close the thread and refer you to Google or the manufacturer's website as that would be the proper place to answer such a question.

[marjamar]

So, I've had occasion to see (more then a few times) both random people and mods (with itchy trigger fingers methinks) more or less reprimand posters who, for whatever reason, asked a question which may have been asked in some way, on some thread before. My question (which may also have been asked before -- Don't know, didn't look), is so what?

So, what's the big deal? Does no one realize that telling someone who is nice enough to come here to play, that they had better play my way, or leave, is both rude and very childish? And, for what reason? Just to keep the little bits running in one direction or something?

I'd have to suggest that keeping people "in line", is far less important then having people willing to come here and share, ask questions and generally keep things happening. That beats a dead, or near dead board any day of the week. And, having been in some very active boards, I can tell you it is far in a way better then visiting one with nearly no activity.

I see here maybe a couple of posts a day per forum, so maybe you guys who decide things around here might want to ease up a bit. Quit moving things around, shutting off threads, and all the other offensive things, unless absolutely necessary for some very good reasons other then "because".

Take it or leave it, it's good advise.

-Rodger

[zagnut]

Can't wait to see CycleWriter's response to this. :hv20-smilie72:

[HueyNRolf]

So you're saying people should be able to post anything they like wherever they want? Get rid of the sub forums?
Sorry to differ, but the sub forums are a good idea. It helps people find stuff and keeps the discussions focused.... If I want to look at videos made by other people I go to 'footage'. If I'm looking for a solution to an editing-related issue and can go to the 'edit' forums, Mac or PC.
I like that someone takes the trouble to move posts to the correct place. Lets say you went into a book store and everything was just mixed together, what sort of an impression would you have?

As for threads getting closed. Seems to me that these are often started by lazy people who can't be bothered to read the manual or the stickies and, in most cases, these threads should be closed.

[antman]

There's a thing called Bandwidth, I suggest you google it before you make an even bigger ass of your self. Besides, no one asked for your advice!!

Most of the people here are friendly, with the exception of me. What gives you the right to come in here 34 posts strong, and tell the mods what should or shouldn't be closed or when it should be moved.

Secondly, no one here gets paid to give advice, it's from the goodness of their hearts as too whether or not they take the time to answer a question. Or give advice on clips and footage. Don't you get, the same posts become redundant after seeing them 50 times. Its a waste of time and space.

get a clue dudette.

[sacredhills]

There's a thing called Bandwidth, I suggest you google it before you make an even bigger ass of your self. Besides, no one asked for your advice!!

Most of the people here are friendly, with the exception of me. What gives you the right to come in here 34 posts strong, and tell the mods what should or shouldn't be closed or when it should be moved.

Secondly, no one here gets paid to give advice, it's from the goodness of their hearts as too whether or not they take the time to answer a question. Or give advice on clips and footage. Don't you get, the same posts become redundant after seeing them 50 times. Its a waste of time and space.

get a clue dudette.

wow, when i search in here i cant find sh*t, all because everyone posts a link to a different thread which posts to another link which doesn't give the information people are looking for. Or they just tell you to google it when they already have! It would be nice for some people to lighten up a bit. - Thanks!

[barq]

There's a thing called Bandwidth, I suggest you google it before you make an even bigger ass of your self. Besides, no one asked for your advice!!

Most of the people here are friendly, with the exception of me. What gives you the right to come in here 34 posts strong, and tell the mods what should or shouldn't be closed or when it should be moved.

Secondly, no one here gets paid to give advice, it's from the goodness of their hearts as too whether or not they take the time to answer a question. Or give advice on clips and footage. Don't you get, the same posts become redundant after seeing them 50 times. Its a waste of time and space.

get a clue dudette.

:hv20-smilie84: Sorry lol I love when people throw in the bandwidth argument when they have no idea what they are talking about. This forums uses very little bandwidth. You know what actually causes problems is the advertising banners themselves which run off a script that also puts a load on the server.....which is worse than bandwidth. But you know what pays for a forum those same advertising banners :hv20-smilie84:

If you are so indifferent about providing help and it rubs you so wrong then don't comment. You turn what is supposed to be a helpful place into a hostile one where new people won't want to ask a question. You know who clicks on banners? New people not old crummy members like you.....if you won't give help you sure as hell ain't going to click on any banners :hv20-smilie84:


OK say for example in your world where bandwidth is the problem. It seems your useless comments in my topic and this one would be a great example of you taking up that "bandwidth" lol :hv20-smilie84:

[marjamar]

So you're saying people should be able to post anything they like wherever they want? Get rid of the sub forums?
Sorry to differ, but the sub forums are a good idea. It helps people find stuff and keeps the discussions focused.... If I want to look at videos made by other people I go to 'footage'. If I'm looking for a solution to an editing-related issue and can go to the 'edit' forums, Mac or PC.
I like that someone takes the trouble to move posts to the correct place. Lets say you went into a book store and everything was just mixed together, what sort of an impression would you have?

As for threads getting closed. Seems to me that these are often started by lazy people who can't be bothered to read the manual or the stickies and, in most cases, these threads should be closed.Did I say that? Don't think so. My suggestion is just that a suggestion, which asks why the overt concern over someone (perhaps someone brand, spankin, new), asking a question? For those of you who have heard the question before and don't feel like answering it again, don't. Pretty simple and perhaps it will even entice the lookers to come a bit to the forefront and help out. As to sub-forums, they more then anything else divide attention away, not direct help towards someone looking for help.

Often, the specifics of the question being asked, venture into other "sub-forum" venues without meaning to. Happened to me, and when I asked nicely for a moderator to put my post back where I knew it belonged, I was not so kindly told it's where it belongs. Not even relevant to the sub-forum it was moved to, it was left to die a slow, agonizing death. It was a great help to me having a thread moved, I'm sure I'm not the only one who has felt this way.

But, this post was not made for me to be about me. It was made because I just happened upon a thread that was closed after someone took the time to ask very nicely for help. After pasting a link to some other post, it was then close. Whomever closed this thread, has little understanding of what it takes to keep people from feeling ostracized, or perhaps he/she does understand it all too well, and likes to pick on people this way. I really don't know and honestly don't care about why it happened, only that it did. Not a good way to run a public board, and since I'm new hear myself, I've little to loose by telling it like it is.

As to people being "lazy" here. You really need to understand that not everyone comes to these board because they feel they lazy. Perhaps they come here to find someone to talk to and along the way get some much needed help. Then again, maybe they are just a bunch of lazy bums.

-Rodger

[marjamar]

For the record.

I've been involved in capturing people, places and things on film and tape for over 40 years. I have had perhaps 50 cameras over this time. I have given help on each of these to someone, sometime, somewhere and have also asked for help on each and every one. This does not make me a professional, nor does it make me smart or dumb. It does show that each of us can use help sometimes and each of us has some help to give.

It really shouldn't be made overly or unnecessarily hard in either case.

-Rodger

[Bob Sanders]

I see here maybe a couple of posts a day per forum, so maybe you guys who decide things around here might want to ease up a bit.

Couldn't agree more.

This forum used to be a hustle and bustle... It most surely has lost some of its luster these days. Now some of that is most likely the simple fact that the life of the HV series is slowly withering and people are moving on. But I'm also pretty sure it has something to do with the way some of the newcomers are treated. I've seen new people sign on to this forum and get sh*t on right off the hop. It's a great way to run a forum into the ground.... if that is what's being sought anyway.

I've also seen some good people run off by..... a little band of brothers around here.

You do recognize Marjamer that you have earned a solid red bar for your efforts thus far. Have no fear.... that'll escalate in no time at all as the "band of brothers" tries slowly to pound you into succession. I wouldn't give it much attention though.... it's not worth the effort.... that and the simple fact that although we have a few moderators that play a .... tough game shall we say, this has to be one of the more liberal forums around... and if you really need to speak your piece.... you're allowed.... you just have to ignore the peanut gallery.

[sacredhills]

So, I've had occasion to see (more then a few times) both random people and mods (with itchy trigger fingers methinks) more or less reprimand posters who, for whatever reason, asked a question which may have been asked in some way, on some thread before. My question (which may also have been asked before -- Don't know, didn't look), is so what?

So, what's the big deal? Does no one realize that telling someone who is nice enough to come here to play, that they had better play my way, or leave, is both rude and very childish? And, for what reason? Just to keep the little bits running in one direction or something?

I'd have to suggest that keeping people "in line", is far less important then having people willing to come here and share, ask questions and generally keep things happening. That beats a dead, or near dead board any day of the week. And, having been in some very active boards, I can tell you it is far in a way better then visiting one with nearly no activity.

I see here maybe a couple of posts a day per forum, so maybe you guys who decide things around here might want to ease up a bit. Quit moving things around, shutting off threads, and all the other offensive things, unless absolutely necessary for some very good reasons other then "because".

Take it or leave it, it's good advise.

-Rodger


We should create our own forum and make it totally awesome! :hv20-smilie84::hv20-smilie84::hv20-smilie84:

[HueyNRolf]

Happened to me, and when I asked nicely for a moderator to put my post back where I knew it belonged, I was not so kindly told it's where it belongs.


Printing back to tape with Sony Vegas?

Of course it's a PC issue, Cyclewriter and Mal made the right call on that one.

[Erik Bien]

I just read this on a completely unrelated forum, but as it seems to apply here, permit me to quote:


Oh, and for the record, anyone who accuses the membership of this forum of being ball busters automatically loses all credibility. If you're being persecuted by this forum's membership then you did something that is universally considered wrong or stupid. Try to learn from it instead of lashing out like a four year old.

[Bob Sanders]

I just read this on a completely unrelated forum, but as it seems to apply here, permit me to quote:

So let me get this straight... you're saying that "forum membership" is NEVER wrong?

[jboy]

We were all noobs on here at one point. Before I even got an HV and joined this forum I had lots of questions. I read the stickies, learned a ton, and found answers to questions I didn't even think of. This forum and the good people on it are part of what made me go with the cam I got. There is a huge amount of experience and knowledge on here nicely split up in sub-forums that make what your looking for a lot easier. The search is a bit of a mess, mainly due to the same things getting asked over and over rather than reading what's already here. If a mod redirects a post it's mainly so it will get answered more quickly in the proper sub-forum and then doesn't clutter the wrong one, don't cry about it. If someone is being a dick just to be one then don't feed the troll. If someone leaves a hilarious reply, don't take it personally, it probably made a bunch of us laugh. If you're too thin skinned to take some ribbing, toughen the F up. If you get negative feedback learn from it and you'll do better next time.

[HueyNRolf]

Is it just me or has anyone else noticed a correlation between complaining about how the forum is run and low contributions?

[zagnut]

So let me get this straight... you're saying that "forum membership" is NEVER wrong?
While I can't go so far as to comment on that, I can comment on something else.

Having the subforums is usually standard practice on any forum site. Without subforums, nothing would be organized. It would be an unorganized, chaotic, clusterf**k.


Don't you get, the same posts become redundant after seeing them 50 times. Its a waste of time and space.
+1. I've been here just long enough to be getting to the point of annoyance from "WTF...Another help me pick a camera" or "WTF...another removing pulldown from 24p" threads.

I compared camera's, for two months, reading every possible review I could find and reading info and opinions on them on the 'net. I didn't go around asking for advice, because everyone has different opinions and brand favorites. I learned how to remove pulldown with the help of google, this websites search feature, and a lot of reading. I don't think it's a matter of, "I can't find s**t when I do a search here." I think it's a matter of, "Oh wow, there's so many f**king posts about this, I'm too lazy to read them."

I think the thing that bugs most of the regulars that give advice, is when someone comes along and is clueless about something. Instead of googling or searching the forum, they make a very vague post. Leaving out details such as frame rates, codecs used, operating system, what editor they are using, etc.

Most of us don't mind helping and are willing to do so. But there comes a point when we just get sick of seeing, and saying, the same things over and over. A good example of that is a new thread here - http://www.hv20.com/showthread.php?t=32776. I mean seriously, how many posts like this do we need? These redundant posts take up server space and make searching for something all that much harder.

If you are going to ask a question, you should be prepared and able to give as much info as you can...after you've read enough about your problem that your eyes bleed and you just can't figure it out. I can only imagine how an elementary school teacher feels.

[omnibozo]

I'm also on a forum for magicians. The 'nasty' comments you folks make are marshmallows compared to the squabbles would-be-David-Copperfields engage in. As here, many posters are beginners, often with attitudes and opinions far beyond anything justified by their experience. I haven't gotten that feeling here nearly as much as in the magician community. I really appreciate all the posts. It isn't that hard to sort out the posters worth reading and those worth skipping. Many thanks to those with real experience for sharing it, and to all the beginners willing to risk the wrath of the mighty by asking a question!

[Pig]

Well, I am in agreementisation with marjamar You peeps need to chill out some, and you all suck,
andthis forum used to be great and now its much sucky.
and Cyclewrite suckls, and so dose mal too, and eric is sucky and some other mods is no good either and all the mods suck

thuis forum is so muck sucky

[HueyNRolf]

Well, I am in agreementisation with marjamar You peeps need to chill out some, and you all suck,
andthis forum used to be great and now its much sucky.
and Cyclewrite suckls, and so dose mal too, and eric is sucky and some other mods is no good either and all the mods suck

thuis forum is so muck sucky

See what I mean?
Maybe there's a correlation between complaining and poor literacy too?

[sacredhills]

See what I mean?
Maybe there's a correlation between complaining and poor literacy too?

Ok i agree with that, that guy was just an idiot.

[zagnut]

I'm also on a forum for magicians. The 'nasty' comments you folks make are marshmallows compared to the squabbles would-be-David-Copperfields engage in. As here, many posters are beginners, often with attitudes and opinions far beyond anything justified by their experience. I haven't gotten that feeling here nearly as much as in the magician community. I really appreciate all the posts. It isn't that hard to sort out the posters worth reading and those worth skipping. Many thanks to those with real experience for sharing it, and to all the beginners willing to risk the wrath of the mighty by asking a question!
Thank you and your welcome.


Well, I am in agreementisation with marjamar You peeps need to chill out some, and you all suck,
andthis forum used to be great and now its much sucky.
and Cyclewrite suckls, and so dose mal too, and eric is sucky and some other mods is no good either and all the mods suck

thuis forum is so muck sucky
No sir, you suck. See attached image for help advice.

[Erik Bien]

andthis forum used to be great and now its much sucky.

http://pix.motivatedphotos.com/2009/12/5/633956211400551745-obvioustrollisobvious.jpg




... nice try, Mal! :hv20-smilie24:

[1]

... nice try, Mal! :hv20-smilie24:




DARN, can't get anything by you...DOUBLE DARN!!


lol
:)

[HueyNRolf]

Well I bought it Mal. You just wait:hv20-smilie68:

He forgets to pay the rent and then trolls us. Oy vey!

[Seo]

Where's CW when you need him... lately he hasn't been showing up much. Or at all, actually.

[1]

He forgets to pay the rent and then trolls us.

ROFL! :hv20-smilie77:

[VideJo]

May I suggest SW to move this posting here? (http://www.hv20.com/showthread.php?t=15846) :hv20-smilie81:
May I also note, that when I was quite new here, I asked a question that gathered an advice to go Google some. But in the end it turned out to grow into a Stickey.

[marjamar]

Well, I went to the provided link. Got as far as page 4 and have seen pretty clearly that honest, thoughtful and for the most part right-on suggestions make zero difference -- In fact, bring on retribution by those with the same thin skin they ask us normal folks not to have.

It really should be obvious to anyone with even the lease amount of reckoning powers that the newbies on this forum offering thoughtful and well expressed suggestions concerning fair and considerate treatment to posters, probably do so because they see just the opposite happening too often. If it bothers you because someone sees what your doing is wrong, perhaps you need to consider not trying so hard to do things which bring you such comments. Either that, or just do as you apparently are doing and make snide remarks about posters offering to show you how to actually elevate yourselves, by stooping to help others. It's a little man that tells people how big he is, instead of showing himself willing to accept help when offered.

You lost a very thoughtful and astute poster (http://www.hv20.com/showpost.php?p=130840&postcount=54) it seems in that linked thread. He offered you very good advise, in a very considerate manner, and was promptly ridiculed for it. To what purpose? Lashing out at someone trying to help is not only rude, it is extremely foolish as everyone reading it will form much stronger opinions based on that single bad behavior then they will on any future good behaviors. It can't help and will only chase away the very people you should want here.

But, as I said before, "What do I know".

-Rodger

[Seo]

Trust me, you'll be better off learning by yourself. I almost never ask questions anymore, just search everythiing up and you'll be good. Try Google instead of this forum's search, and try different forums. I like the PSW Recording forums, Gearslutz, the rapbattles forum, DVXUser, and some others for audio, and DVXUser and DVinfo for video stuff. The rest is covered by misc sites and such.

[marjamar]

I'm a member of a bunch of camera and other forums. Been a member at DVXuser as soon as I found Jarrad had started it (knew him from some other forums). The thing is, this forum has info and helps and most likely an exceptional knowledge base in it's users through their posts and their replies. It is all too foolish to snub people wanting help and wanting to help. It would be so much better if a few of those who feel some "need" to be hard(whatever), to take-out their frustrations somewhere more private and keep at least a modicum of thoughtfulness to users -- Especially new ones.

-Rodger

[antman]

We should create our own forum and make it totally awesome! :hv20-smilie84::hv20-smilie84::hv20-smilie84:

Your welcome to try. Although it's not cheap and costs a good amount of money. Not to mention the time involved is a job in it's self.:hv20-smilie70:

[marjamar]

I've had a part in creating a few forums, it alot of work and time spent. I also have moderated a few over the years, now I just take care of my companies websites and related online exposures.

Any comments I've made here are not personal, or meant to be. They are comments which I can guarantee are true, as I've seen exactly what is being allowed to happen here ruin a number of otherwise very active and profitable boards. I've no personal interest in the success or failure of this forum as well, only a desire to have places to go on the internet which both help me and allow me to help others. Vindictiveness really shouldn't have a platform to spew it's hate from, and it only takes a little of it to sour enough people where it becomes more the norm then the rare event.

I suppose I've said what I believe I need to. I really hope that some of the crew here take my words as an effort to help, not harm.

Take care.

-Rodger

[Mars]

Does no one realize that telling someone who is nice enough to come here to play, that they had better play my way, or leave, is both rude and very childish? And, for what reason?

This forum is about knowledge. There are just a lot of people that register, ask a trivial question that's been answered a dozen times before (or even in their cameras manual), without 'wasting' just a few minutes of THEIR precious time with searching, and then disappear.
That just shows no appreciation whatsoever for those who spend time figuring out stuff. The help they expect is just taken for granted.
The simple line "I have searched and skimmed trough the faqs." would change the situation.
Also I don't think this forum is _primarily_ aimed at answering questions but meant to gather knowledge on the topic. Information that can easily be found using the search afterwards. But only if there aren't 1000 threads dealing with the same topic!


I'd have to suggest that keeping people "in line", is far less important then having people willing to come here and share, ask questions and generally keep things happening. That beats a dead, or near dead board any day of the week.

I don't think this board can be considered 'near dead'. It's just not as massive and impenetrable as others. I like it :hv20-smilie110:

[sacredhills]

Heh, Noone likes me now since i agreed with marjamar, what a F*cked up place. :hv20-smilie84::hv20-smilie84::hv20-smilie84:

[KingDucky]

This forum is about knowledge. There are just a lot of people that register, ask a trivial question that's been answered a dozen times before (or even in their cameras manual), without 'wasting' just a few minutes of THEIR precious time with searching, and then disappear.

Exactly. There's 26,000 some odd members here. Like 20k of those are people who demand answers with out searching and then just leave. I lurked here for 6 months before joining. And in those 6 months I was convinced(by most of the people here) to buy an Hv30 and also learned a lot of valuable information.

Also A fair amount of newbies first post is demanding an answer.(mine was:hv20-smilie122:) Look at this (http://hv20.com/showthread.php?t=30730) guy. His first post was just a greeting..plus he's awesome. But there's also tons of other people who are very helpful without being here long.

So just chill out and use the search button.:hv20-smilie84:

[1]

Heh, Noone likes me now since i agreed with marjamar, what a F*cked up place. :hv20-smilie84::hv20-smilie84::hv20-smilie84:

Well, Pig2 agreed too, and look where that got him!


marjamar, what you say has been said before, and stems from comparing one forum with another.
If you wanted this forum to be IDENTICAL with another forum, why bother having two separate ones?

This forum is what it is, with the members and moderators that we have.

It won't change because of this thread...

[marjamar]

marjamar, what you say has been said before, and stems from comparing one forum with another.
If you wanted this forum to be IDENTICAL with another forum, why bother having two separate ones?

This forum is what it is, with the members and moderators that we have.

It won't change because of this thread...Or, maybe it just stems from people seeing somethings in common they can't agree with. If this thread won't promote some change for the better, what will?

Anyway, haven't you heard, change is the in thing these days!

-Rodger

[HueyNRolf]

Heh, Noone likes me now since i agreed with marjamar, what a F*cked up place.

Really? You didn't say that when you needed help about buying accessories for $230, advice on using Sony Vegas and opinions on a preamp.
You and the other complainers on this thread have contributed dick all to this forum, you come here to get spoon fed by the forum contributors and then have the temerity, THE TEMERITY, to complain about how the place is run.
I don't think anyone would care if the likes of you didn't participate here.

I say toss these worthless complainers overboard and good riddance.

[cgbier]

Can this thread be merged with the other "I demand the mods do this this or that" threads?

[sacredhills]

Really? You didn't say that when you needed help about buying accessories for $230, advice on using Sony Vegas and opinions on a preamp.
You and the other complainers on this thread have contributed dick all to this forum, you come here to get spoon fed by the forum contributors and then have the temerity, THE TEMERITY, to complain about how the place is run.
I don't think anyone would care if the likes of you didn't participate here.

I say toss these worthless complainers overboard and good riddance.

This is why everyone leaves. :hv20-smilie81:

[HueyNRolf]

This is why everyone leaves.

Well what are you waiting for?
:hv20-smilie24:

[sacredhills]

Well what are you waiting for?
:hv20-smilie24:

Sorry i dont have to leave because someone tells me to. This is just a damn forum. Why so Serious? :hv20-smilie45:

[1]

Why so Serious? :hv20-smilie45:


You use smileys to indicate humour (:hv20-smilie81:) and Huey's smiley is smiley too: :hv20-smilie24:

Who's serious?

[sacredhills]

You use smileys to indicate humour (:hv20-smilie81:) and Huey's smiley is smiley too: :hv20-smilie24:

Who's serious?

I wasn't being serious lol This forum is awesome, im on here like every day!

[Erik Bien]

This forum is awesome, im on here like every day!

This one has spirit. 600 quatloos on the newcomer! :hv20-smilie157:

[VideJo]

Like some others here, I have gone a long way getting where I am at video. So I knew "a couple of things" before I logged in here. So some threads by newcomers also look redundant to me.
Nevertheless I have this itchy feeling, that the gap in knowledge between newbees and oldies is quite large in here. With camcorder prices as low as they are these days (sorry to the poor people), people buy a cam on the corner, convinced by the seller, that this is all they need. "Just connect it to your pc and you are set!"
I know, everything can be found on the Net these days, but imagine that you just started. You have no idea, how much knowledge you lack tso make a decent film.

[HueyNRolf]

I agree with VideJo

[Dr. Benway]

What's your opinion? Is it Internet or internet? I'm using Internet.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_capitalization_conventions - The Internet standards community has historically differentiated between the Internet and an internet (or internetwork), the first being treated as a proper noun with a capital letter, and the latter as a common noun with lower-case first letter.

[Gillvane]

Search the forum, search the freaking forum. Guess what I do search your crappy forum and to be honest the stickied posts are just a jumbled mess of information. Why don't you spend the time and take the info that is within 12 pages and compile it into one? Instead you tell everyone to wade through the crap yourself.

Why do we even have forums? Just about every question has been answered "somewhere" so lets just lock all the forums and tell people to search it. /sarcasm off

.

The search function often yields topics that tell people to go search. It's really counter productive, IMO.

How can I do X?

Well, it's been posted before. Go search X!

What happens when someone does a search for "X"?

The get this:

How can I do "X"?

It's been posted before, go search "X"!

Lovely. Now the question is unanswered, and there are lots of threads with X in them, that dont' answer the question.

[iThinkergoiMac]

To be honest, I haven't really had much trouble with the search function. While searching, I don't click on threads with less than 5 replies, typically. This avoids the majority of the threads you're talking about.

Also, I go with "internet". Back in the day, it was an official entity. Now it's a commodity. But what does that have to do with the subject of this thread?

[cgbier]

A conspiracy of the mods to not only ruin this forum, but the whole internet?

[iThinkergoiMac]

Oh noes! We must revolt! Grab your pitchforks, everybody, Mal and Lunchbox are out to take over the world! :hv20-smilie165:

[Lunchbox]

Are you Reid Welch?

[Gillvane]

To be honest, I haven't really had much trouble with the search function. While searching, I don't click on threads with less than 5 replies, typically. This avoids the majority of the threads you're talking about.

Also, I go with "internet". Back in the day, it was an official entity. Now it's a commodity. But what does that have to do with the subject of this thread?

Still, the result is counter productive.

I am a newb, wondering what the answer is to this question "How do I do X?"

I see, aha! this very subject posted "How do I do X?"

IMO, it only ads to thread clutter, and enlightens no one, to post "go search". Unless you goal is not to enlighten others that are seeking information.

I click on it. What do I get? "You should use search, the answer has already been posted before."

When in many cases, the person that posted this could have stated the answer in just as many, or in some cases, less words.

If your true goal is to share information, then I think it's inarguable that the best approach is to allow people who are willing, to answer a question 100 times, if it is asked 100 times, and allow people to ignore a post if they do not wish to share information they possess.

[1]

If your true goal is to share information...

Well, that's where you're wrong then! :hv20-smilie84:

There's no true [or untrue] goal. It's just a bunch of people from all around the globe yapping to each other about a cam and stuff. Many here put in considerable time to help others, and to make this site work. It's those people who decide on how this site runs.....and rightly so.

It's not counterproductive....it just is what it is...

[iThinkergoiMac]

Are you Reid Welch?

My post was only about 20 words... hardly Welch material ;)

[Erik Bien]

If your true goal is to share information, then I think it's inarguable that the best approach is to allow people who are willing, to answer a question 100 times, if it is asked 100 times, and allow people to ignore a post if they do not wish to share information they possess.

That approach works great for something like Canon's technical support knowledge base, which searches customer e-mails for key words, builds an answer out of fragments of boilerplate, and SPAMs back the result.

We, however, aren't that fancy: here, questions are read by actual human volunteers, who get bored much quicker than any database. If you can't be bothered to search, read the FAQ and the stickies (not to mention your camcorder's Instruction Manual) and you're so thin-skinned as to take offense when anyone suggests you do additional research to answer your own question, you're probably better off querying Canon's help-bot than an internet forum full of wisenheimers.

[Gillvane]

That approach works great for something like Canon's technical support knowledge base, which searches customer e-mails for key words, builds an answer out of fragments of boilerplate, and SPAMs back the result.

We, however, aren't that fancy: here, questions are read by actual human volunteers, who get bored much quicker than any database. If you can't be bothered to search, read the FAQ and the stickies (not to mention your camcorder's Instruction Manual) and you're so thin-skinned as to take offense when anyone suggests you do additional research to answer your own question, you're probably better off querying Canon's help-bot than an internet forum full of wisenheimers.

Please Read the sticky, here's the link to what you are looking for:
link

We're bored and don't want to post the link again, so please read the stickies, and do a search.

IMO, one is more productive than the other. It takes equal effort to do both, but one results in the faster transfer of information than the other.

It takes on effort at all to simply ignore the thread, and let someone else answer the question, if they choose to do so.

You're approach results in this, and I have seen it on this forum on many occaisions.

I'm looking for X.

X has already been discussed, read the stickies and do a search.

I did a search, but I didn't find X.

That's because you searched for X sub 1 and you should have searched for X sub 2 which would have given you better results.

Ok, I did a search for X sub 2, but i found this " " and it didn't answer my question, because I'm looking for X sub 3 really.

Please read the stickies.

Well, I read the stickies, and I didn't understand this part " ".

And then, after all that wasted effort, someone posts:

The answer is Y.

Why not avoid that whole thread, and simply post, the answer is Y, and ignore the thread if you are to jaded to answer the question?

I've seen it more than once. It seems like an inefficient way to transfer information to me.

The result is generally the same, the question is answered.

The only difference with your approach, is a lot of condescending and wasted posts about searching are added to the thread.

[1]

With all the time you spent writing this whole post, you could of helped and answered many newbie's questions.

YOU are SOOOOO unproductive!!!


:hv20-smilie77:



Please Read the sticky, here's the link to what you are looking for:
link

We're bored and don't want to post the link again, so please read the stickies, and do a search.

IMO, one is more productive than the other. It takes equal effort to do both, but one results in the faster transfer of information than the other.

It takes on effort at all to simply ignore the thread, and let someone else answer the question, if they choose to do so.

You're approach results in this, and I have seen it on this forum on many occaisions.

I'm looking for X.

X has already been discussed, read the stickies and do a search.

I did a search, but I didn't find X.

That's because you searched for X sub 1 and you should have searched for X sub 2 which would have given you better results.

Ok, I did a search for X sub 2, but i found this " " and it didn't answer my question, because I'm looking for X sub 3 really.

Please read the stickies.

Well, I read the stickies, and I didn't understand this part " ".

And then, after all that wasted effort, someone posts:

The answer is Y.

Why not avoid that whole thread, and simply post, the answer is Y, and ignore the thread if you are to jaded to answer the question?

I've seen it more than once. It seems like an inefficient way to transfer information to me.

The result is generally the same, the question is answered.

The only difference with your approach, is a lot of condescending and wasted posts about searching are added to the thread.

[iThinkergoiMac]

Please Read the sticky, here's the link to what you are looking for:
link

We're bored and don't want to post the link again, so please read the stickies, and do a search.

IMO, one is more productive than the other. It takes equal effort to do both, but one results in the faster transfer of information than the other.

So it takes as much work to tell someone to read the sticky as it does to tell them to read the sticky and link to it? Seems like that's not possible.

[BWC]

I used to love this thread.

[Gillvane]

With all the time you spent writing this whole post, you could of helped and answered many newbie's questions.

YOU are SOOOOO unproductive!!!


:hv20-smilie77:

Being a newb myself, it's hard for me to answer many questions.

From now on, whenver anyone asks a quesiton, I will reply

"That's been asked before. Do a search!"

[tvnewsbadge]

[QUOTE=Gillvane;322374
Why not avoid that whole thread, and simply post, the answer is Y, and ignore the thread if you are to jaded to answer the question?

I've seen it more than once. It seems like an inefficient way to transfer information to me.

.[/QUOTE]

Except the purpose of that kind of responder not to transfer information, it's something else entirely

[Seo]

I learned just fine, didn't I? And that was when CW was around.

I think that this isn't that important a topic. If you're gonna be offended by some random guy on the Internet you don't even know, then why are you even here? And the counter productive thing... I admit that it can be slightly annoying, but Google is much better at searching this site and can easily give you the answers you need.

Btw, it feels good to be back.

[Duke]

Please Read the sticky, here's the link to what you are looking for: link We're bored and don't want to post the link again, so please read the stickies, and do a search.
<snip>
I've seen it more than once. It seems like an inefficient way to transfer information to me.

The result is generally the same, the question is answered.

The only difference with your approach, is a lot of condescending and wasted posts about searching are added to the thread.

What? You think your entitled to an answer? :hv20-smilie84:

If nothing else you'll have a much greater feeling of satisfaction if you put some effort into it, plus when you work at it you'll remember it longer, which is one reason our education system is so bad.

Kids think teachers are there to teach them, and blame the teachers. I have news for you. Students are there to learn and they don't spend enough time or effort to learn things. :hv20-smilie64:

(This is a comment on society and not you specifically.)

[Gillvane]

What? You think your entitled to an answer? :hv20-smilie84:

If nothing else you'll have a much greater feeling of satisfaction if you put some effort into it, plus when you work at it you'll remember it longer, which is one reason our education system is so bad.

Kids think teachers are there to teach them, and blame the teachers. I have news for you. Students are there to learn and they don't spend enough time or effort to learn things. :hv20-smilie64:

(This is a comment on society and not you specifically.)

This has been discussed before. Please do a search.

[CamCam]

Every internet forum faces the same issues. Most are either under-moderated or over-moderated. Each has limitations, but over-moderated are more likely to be good forums.

As has been said already, I find that some information is not available on the forum in the first several pages of a search, but instead there are countless closed threads that come up with someone asking a similar question.

I just use other internet resources. The mods are appointed by the forum administrator who owns and runs the show. If you don't like the way the barkeeper keeps the bar, then it's time to visit a different bar.

[tvnewsbadge]

I agree, this seems to be only forum I visit ( except for some auto forums) where you have to be inhibited about what questions your ask lest you be accused of committing temerity.

This really isn't a problem once you learn that's just the way some people are, but I feel sorry for the newbies who might take the abuse seriously and thereby extend their learning curve.

That's why I've always felt this forum needs 'newbies corner" where mods aren't allowed and the information exchange can be pain free.
Every time I suggest this though, I get accused of committing temerity.

[1]

That's why I've always felt this forum needs 'newbies corner" where mods aren't allowed and the information exchange can be pain free.

The audacity!!!!

[Seo]

You know, there's a piece of ancient Chinese literature that goes, "故天將降大任於是人也，必先苦其心志，勞其筋骨，餓其體膚，空乏其身，行拂亂其所為，所以動心忍性，曾益其 所不能。" Basically what it means is that if God wishes for you to become someone great, He must first put you through many troubles and hardships, so that you can overcome anything. This might not be as epic as that, but if a newbie wants to learn really fast, he can have everything spoon fed to him, but if he wants to learn well and be able to learn on his own in the future, maybe this is the way to teach them.

[1]

Basically what it means is .....


Are you SURE that's what it means? Because baidu translates it as:


"Be jealous of necessarily first bitter overseas ? Bo it's will therefore day ? 13. swings long bamboo conduit Wu, ?
flatters to wash to catch fish with fishnet leading ? ? I it's ? w ? w , the destitute whose body , line whisk ? y it's
institute ? large-leaved dogwood ? therefore ? has abundant ? of Na silk ribbon to broaden his knowledge , develop his capabilities."

:hv20-smilie81:

[Seo]

Haha, it's ancient Chinese literature. Kinda like Shakespeare, you need to first translate into modern Chinese and then translate it.

But that is funny, I always wanted to know what'd happen if you put that into a translator! :hv20-smilie87:

[1]

Hehe, well, I deliberately picked Baidu. Google sees it as:

So day to drop a large office so people, we must first suffer their aspirations, their bones labor, their body skin hunger,
depletion of their body, Line whisk it was chaos, so fond of Ren Xing, had it not beneficial.


And Systran:

Therefore the day Jiang Daren therefore person, must its will, toil with one's sinews and bones first painstakingly,
the hungry its body skin, destitute its, the line strokes the chaotic its behavior, therefore the moving patience, adds to its cannot.

Gotta love Chinese! :)

[CycleWriter]

I learned just fine, didn't I? And that was when CW was around.

I'm still "around.":hv20-smilie68:

[tvnewsbadge]

The good thing is that most of the worst ones have apparently gotten bored with this and don't hang out much anymore.
There one guy who was SO proud of being an lalalalalalala that he made it his Vivitar and he'd pop up in just about every single thread.

[iThinkergoiMac]

Don't you mean "avatar"? Vivitar is a sub-standard camera manufacturing company ;)

[Seo]

Wait a second... tvnewsbadge, don't tell me you're talking about the guy who just posted above you...

Because if you were, lmao! :hv20-smilie87::hv20-smilie87:

[tvnewsbadge]

Don't you mean "avatar"? Vivitar is a sub-standard camera manufacturing company ;)

Exactly, as is his profile pic.

To SEO, geeesh, you're right. Looks like I'm committing temerity again.

[CycleWriter]

At least I'm not a passive-agressive little douche.:hv20-smilie84: